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Power window goes down but only sometimes goes up

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7.6K views 19 replies 9 participants last post by  georgerousakis1963  
M
#1 · (Edited)
Hi, hope you're doing well! I have a ZC33s 2021 (non hybrid, imported from Japan for Latin America) whose front passenger's window will go down without issues but will only sometimes go up (when it does go up, it does so at the usual speed).

Of note is that this happens whether the window is operated from the passenger or driver's switches and is sporadic. Sometimes it won't happen for days only to not go up on a given drive. If I keep pulling the button, or pull it up multiple times, or wait some time, it'll then work as usual.

The passenger's side switch has 5 pins, while the driver's side cluster has many more.

Image


I've tracked down which pins are which using continuity mode on my multimeter. The diagram has both switches at resting position and the window should go up with both arrows of a given switch pointing up (i.e., arrow 4 to gray cable, arrow 2 to yellow cable for the passenger's side switch). Pin numbers (1-5) correspond to left to right in the image above.

Image



I made this diagram myself, so it could be wrong. I couldn't find a more official diagram. Good news is that the system doesn't appear to have relays or use the car's computer in any way.

Here are some troubleshooting steps I've done:
  1. Verify that the window channels are dirt free.
  2. Clean both switches with a contact cleaning solution. This helped for a while, and I did this before diagnosing switches with the multimeter.
  3. Diagnose switches with the multimeter by using continuity mode to create a circuit diagram (attached). The switches not once failed to give continuity when I pulled them, so they seem to be working fine.
  4. Move the passenger's side switch and cabling around while pulling the switch to see if it's a wiring issue. Doesn't seem to be.
  5. While the fault was happening, I pulled the driver's side switch up but the passenger's window didn't move. I then probed different pins in the passenger's switch (from the rear, with the switch connected) and got:
    1. 11.7V between yellow wire and a ground screw in the door.
    2. 0V between light green wire and same ground screw in the door.
    3. 0V between red and dark green (the motor cables). This was confusing. I expected +-12V.
  6. While the fault was happening, I took the passenger's side wire harness (switch disconnected) and made some connections by hand to emulate the switch.
    1. Connected wires from dark green to gray and from red to light green. Window went down.
    2. Connected wires from dark green to yellow and from red to gray. Window didn't go up.
    3. I measured 12V between gray and yellow but, even with the cable connections I stated in 8.2, I measured 0V between red and dark green (motor cables). Unexpected.
When at fault, the motor doesn't make a loud sound like all other (working) windows do when I try to pull them up but they're already up. However, if I pull all the paneling off, the first click to go up after I click the down button does make a faint and quick noise. Subsequent pulls of the switch cause no noise. If I push it down and up after this, I get the same faint noise again.

This all leads me to believe the issue is the the white connector of the wire harness. How can I further diagnose this? I can re-do any of the tests I mentioned in case you suspect the results are awry just to be sure.

Thanks!
 
M
#2 ·
Updates:
I measured motor resistance when the window was working normally at 4.85 Ω. I just measured it with the window not going up ant it was 1.27 Ω. This seems to indicate a shorted winding, no? This might be my issue.

I measured voltages across multiple pins. Here are the results:
Image

Note that **** means I measured the voltages at the harness without the switch connected and WIPS means I measured from the back of the harness with the switch connected.
 
M
#4 ·
Where would you measure this "voltage drop" so that it's useful? Across where and under which circumstance?

I could read amperage as well (i.e., the red wire to the motor) but, given the motor doesn't even turn, I think I'd read 0A. What current would you try to measure?

The resistance check across the motor is useful to check if the winding is shorted, right? If I get less resistance than a known good motor, then there should be a short (like the varnish covering the wire having gone bad). This doesn't explain why the motor works perfectly well on the down direction. Maybe gravity + the shorted part of the winding is enough to lower the window?
 
#5 ·
Machinesia said:
I could read amperage as well (i.e., the red wire to the motor) but, given the motor doesn't even turn, I think I'd read 0A. What current would you try to measure?
Click to expand...
Every time I've had a power window stop working, it's either been a faulty switch (high resistance, which causes no or low current) - or - a stalled motor (because of a stuck or binding mechanism) - a stalled motor will have a higher than usual current draw. Measuring the motor current is a quick & easy way to determine which of the two is causing the problem.
 
M
#6 ·
I took it to a shop on Monday. They concluded it's the driver's side window switch that doesn't rest properly, so the yellow ground wire isn't grounding correctly. They concluded this because, when at fault, if they connected the light green and yellow wires on the driver's side and pulled the passenger's switch, it pulled up. They cleaned the switch and it started to work.

They tested the motor with an external power source both in and outside the car and it worked flawlessly in both directions every time.

Tuesday night it stopped working. Took it there again yesterday, they cleaned the passenger's switch and it started working.

Today I tried it again from the driver's switch and it goes down and when I pull it up, the window keeps going down. It's misbehaving, but they say they didn't cut any wires (though I saw them strip insulation to test things).

I'm completely at a loss. I don't even know how to properly diagnose this anymore because the issue seems to get resolved just by cleaning the switches but for a very short while.

I think I can test their hypothesis by testing continuity between the yellow wire and the negative battery pole. Any other clues?
 
#8 ·
The switches arc under normal usage and eventually stop working, cleaning them fixes the problem but only for a time, replacing them usually works out better, I've been using chinese made switches from an ebay seller going as "switch doctor" because they have bigger, more robust contacts than the OEM switches, but I have no idea if he has switches to fit your car.
 
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