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Clutch problems

14K views 20 replies 6 participants last post by  RMIII  
#1 ·
A week ago my clutch gave out on me due to a bad cable and improper adjustments. I took it all apart and decided to replace the flywheel (Sachs), clutch kit (Luk), and cable (Altrom ultra 8). I tried to set everything up by the book, set pedal height to just above the brake pedal, adjust cable joint nut to 1/4"of play, checked pedal free play and had way too much. It also felt very spongy. So I removed the free play at the joint nut completely and the pedal free play was better but still too much and spongy. I also only had 11/16" of pull on the cable, not the 1" specified on Fixkick. Started the engine, in neutral, with the truck up on jack stands. The clutch pedal depressed and it would not go into any gears. I started to think I must have installed the clutch disc backwards. My reason for thinking that is that I had done that on an old Ford tractor and had the same results with trying to shift. Pulled it all apart again and everything was correct! So I reassembled it again and the only way it seems to "work" is by raising the clutch pedal height to it's max and removing every bit of free play at the cable joint nut. Rechecked the cable pull and had just barely 1". Does this sound like a bad (new) cable or am I missing something?
I apologize for the long post. Any suggestions?

RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l
 
Discussion starter · #4 ·
I'm not the original owner but have owned it since it was all original (only 2 years old, purchased at original selling dealership). I remember a while back the clutch cable got really stiff so I replaced it. Then shortly after that the clutch pedal weld broke and twisted off the pedal completely. I figured it was just fatigue so I replaced the pedal with a new one but did not replace the cable at that time. Fast forward to a week ago and my clutch had a complete failure due to a bad cable that I had over adjusted to get it to continue to function. I just looked at the pedal weld and it appears it has started to fail. The paint has flaked off at the weld so I'm thinking it got twisted between being over adjusted and the cable going bad. I'm going to remove it and check it very well. Perhaps have it rewelded. I'll check the whole assembly for cracks at the same time. The firewall is fine where the cable passes through.

RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
Well I took a closer look at what's going on and I'm pretty sure the new cable is the problem.
The weld on the pedal is not broken, my eyes fooled me a bit. The paint wasn't flaking off, just a scratch from when it was installed. No other cracks or damage to brackets or firewall bulkhead.
I reset the pedal height to 5mm above the brake pedal then measured the distance it actually pulls the cable right where the cable hooks to the bracket. It was awkward but I measured 1-1/8" of throw. Does anyone know if this is sufficient? Measured the throw at the other end at the joint nut and only had 11/16" so bad cable right? It also has a spongy feel to it.
I'm going to order a Suzuki cable from the stealership just to be sure. They quoted me $83 and 3-5 days for it to be delivered.

RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l
 
Discussion starter · #6 ·
If you’ve confirmed that you’ve routed the cable correctly and you have the same housing (and not the older, lock nut type), I would measure your original cable, and measure the new one that you bought, to confirm that they are the same. Often times, replacement ones are not.
The routing had been the same since new.i replaced the cable once some time ago and it has since failed and I made sure to route the replacement the same correct way also.
I do not have the original to compare it to, just another brand of aftermarket that for all I know was wrong to begin with! I'm ordering a Suzuki cable from the stealership to be sure I have the correct cable.

RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
I got the new cable from Suzuki and installed it. However, I'm having the exact same issue trying to get it adjusted properly. It seems the only way I can get it to work is to have the pedal fully raised and remove just about all the slack from the lever arm on the transmission. I still only get about 3/4" of movement at the arm but it allows me to drive the car.
I'm not sure if it's related to the clutch system or the transmission rebuild but when driving the car I cannot get it into first until I'm just about stopped and when shifting either up or down into second gear it slightly grinds. All other gears go smooth. I've also noticed occasionally (mostly when it's cold and I first start driving) I get an angry bird chirp noise when the clutch is released and I begin to accelerate. It increases with speed and goes away when I push in the clutch pedal to shift but then comes back when the pedal is released again. It doesn't last long and once it stops I won't hear it again until after I let the car sit overnight again. Any ideas? This car is starting to drive me crazy again.... Remembering why I parked it 10 years ago....

RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l
 
Discussion starter · #11 ·
First gear used to be synchronize before I had it rebuilt, and sometimes it goes in while moving with no problem. It never grinds into first, just either won't go or is tough to push into.
The spin down test passed. I can push in the clutch and shift almost immediately into reverse, no need to wait nine seconds.
It's the shifting into second gear that is really getting me concerned. Its just not right. If I shift it slowly it will grind terribly. If I shift it quickly it goes in without grinding but it's very rough. I think I may have to bring the car to the transmission shop that rebuilt the trans. Problem is I brought them the transmission to rebuild without the whole car so I feel like they may blame the issues on something else.


RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l
 
Discussion starter · #17 ·
Have you changed the fluid since the rebuild? Quick easy usually a good insight to what's going on inside that gearbox.
I have not changed the fluid since the rebuild. It only has around 400 miles on it. I did check the level recently and it was still up to the fill plug.


RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l
 
Discussion starter · #18 ·
Sounds to me like it's more of a clutch problem than an internal trans problem, especially with the issues of it going into gear while running. The clutch isn't fully releasing.
I'd like to think it's releasing fully. I tried depressing the clutch at highway speed (3500rpm) and the engine idled down to around 800- 900rpm or so. I can also shift it into 3,4, or 5 at that speed with the pedal depressed but it will not shift into 1 or 2. If it wasn't releasing it should have stayed at higher rpm? I'm thinking something went wrong with the rebuild. They had to replace the input shaft. I'm not familiar with the inner workings of this transmission. Are the first and second gears on the input shaft? Perhaps not pressed into the correct place? IDK but something is off.

RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l
 
Discussion starter · #20 ·
Personally, I’d go back to whoever rebuilt the tranny, as it sounds like the synchro for 1st and 2nd isn’t correct. By the way, just as an aside, years ago, I was taught never to downshift to first, unless the car was practically stationary.
I don't typically downshift into 1st while moving but sometimes traffic is moving very slowly and 2nd is too high (lugs). I'm bringing it in to the rebuilder this weekend

RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l
 
Discussion starter · #21 ·
Didn't make it to the transmission shop this past weekend, however, I drained the fluid and replaced it with Redline MT-85. What a difference! Second gear no longer grinds, still feels a bit rough but no more grinding. I can also get it into first gear while still rolling, however, the transmission makes a sort of spooling up whining sound before it goes in fully. It's been a little over 50 miles since the fluid change and I think it's as good as it's going to get. I may still bring it by the transmission shop when I have the time but as for now time is not on my side!

RMIII
1996 Suzuki X-90 2wd manual 16valve 1.6l