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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I swear I used to have an account here but I just registered this name again. :confused:

Due to the apperent lack of interest at zukiworld, I'm moving my tread here to see if you guys can give some advice or at least get a kick out of the build.

The car:
1996 Suzuki X-90

The build:
2002 Tracker H25A v6 swap
1998 Sidekick front diff (searching for 4:30 gears if anyone has them)
2002 Tracker hub flanges (for AWD)
2008 Grand Vitara 5-speed manual trans
2008 Grand Vitara T-case (single mode with center diff) (for AWD)
199x Honda v6 ECU (OBD2, speed density, no MAF)
AEM FIC piggy back (boost management)
650cc Injectors (unknown what fits H25A rails yet)
2x Garrett T25 turbos (twin set from Nissan 300z)

I'll be making the car full time AWD using what Suzuki calls a "singlemode" transfercase. It doesn't have a shifter and has a center diff. The H25A intake bolts on backwards so I can ditch that large pipe with the throttle body on it and use twin throttle bodies (from Hyundai Excel). I haven't decided if I'm going cheap and making log-style manifolds from the old H25A manis or if I'm going to make shorty tube style manifolds. I need the engine in the car first to see how things lay out.

I own an '02 XR2 Tracker that I bought with a blown engine. I put a junkyard H25A in it and use it as a daily driver. I just aquired a '99 Tracker 2-door with a 2.0L that runs great. I'm swapping the engine, ecu, and harness from the '99 into the '02 so I can have my engine back for the X-90 build. I'm likely selling the '02 anyways.

Here's the old '02 engine I'm using for my mock-up. The manifold is backwards with the TBs held in place by one stud just to show what I'm intending. I'll need to make adapter plates for them and also a shaft to sync them off a single cable. I will need 1/4" spacers at the heads so the runners clear the valve cover but otherwise it's a nice fit and gives me more firewall clearence. I plan to move the engine back as far as I can to put the shifter in a more comfortable position and also to shift the weight back a bit.

If I can I want to put the '99 rack and pinion in the X-90. I really hate the steering box on it. WAY to many turns to control such a short wheelbase. How the [email protected]#$ can I control a drift with such slow steering on such a short car? o.o Oh well, AWD doughnuts it is. :)

The weakest link in the drivetrain besides the bottom end (more on that later) is going to be the trans. All 3 diffs should handle the boosted engine's torque just fine considering it's less then would be applied in 4-low. At least I can speak for the front and rear. The center is another story but if it's the same center diff used in the GV's 4-mode system it should handle the torque just fine. Not to mention the GV is a heavy SUV with towing capacity and my little X90 is just a street toy.

Everything should make for a nice symetrical layout. Pardon my drawing. ^_^ Finally a pic of the car lowered with Mazda 6 17s on it. I need more drop but I have to get the engine in first. Rear shocks ended up being from a Ford Mustang II to prevent the rear end from dropping too low. The springs would otherwise fall out if I used the stock shocks.







It's about time someone posted some real information on the H25A. Here's some info I've dug up.

2.5L H25A:
Size - 153ci (2.5L)
CR - 9.5:1

Cylinder:
Bore 84mm
Stroke 75mm
CR -9.5:1

Rod: (Rods specs as measured by myself and another who's building a J20.)
BE bore - 53mm (no bearings)
PE bore - 21.003-21.011mm
CC Length - 143.2mm
PE width - 18.9mm (digital caliper)
BE width - 20.9mm (digital caliper)
Oil sprayers build into rod BE

Pistons:
Diameter - 83.980-83.990mm
Pin - 20.996-21mm (full float)
Pin Bore - 21mm
Pin center to top - 29.5mm
Pin offset about ~2mm

Crankshaft:
Main journal - A 64.994-65.999mm, B 64.988-64.994mm, C 64.981-64.988 (marked on
Rod journal - A 49.982-49.999mm, B 49.733-49.748mm

Block:
Bore - 1 84.10-84.18mm, 2 84.000-84.008mm (marked on deck surface)
Bore limit - 84.049mm
Bore taper - 0.1mm
Bore out of round - 0.1mm
Deck warpage - .061mm

I'll update as I find out more info.

Pauter make rods for this engine and the J20 (same rod) and maybe fits others. Part# SUZ-210-530-1430F6 6pcs I-beam. About $1200 o.o
 

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Discussion Starter #2 (Edited)
Now for some engine nitty gritty.

Everything I know about the H25A has been from searching the internet and crossing part numbers so take it all with a grain of salt.

It's a 24 valve, DOHC, closed deck, two piece, 4-bolt "mains", aluminum block with a forged steel crank. Far as I can tell the crank is neutrally balanced. Looks like a fairly meaty crank. I've seen alot worse. It's all leads to a great engine -BUT- Suzuki blew it with this ridiculous epic failure of a timing chain setup and the chain driven oil pump. I'd bet the car that blows first.

It's my understanding the J20 (and maybe the J18) use the same rods and pistons as the H25A. If that's the case, Pauter makes rods for me but it's about $1200 a set! Screw that. I found that Focus pistons will fit the bore but the pin is located higher. I can't find my notes but say it was 2mm higher. I found BMW rods that are say 1.8mm longer. Whatever this combo was it dropped the piston just a hair which was fine for a boosted engine. The BMW rod needed the pin opened (I think) and I couldn't verify the BE width. The B20 Honda pistons will fit the H25A also but the pistons would need the pin hole opened a bit to float the pin and would need clip groves cut into them. The B20 pistons are also higher comperssion and I don't know how low I can get them. 8:1 on a B20 might wind up 9.5 on the H25A so who knows with that combo.

Can someone find me ALL the rod dimensions for the H25A? I also need to find out the distance from the pin to the top of the piston. It took me forever to find that info and I cant find my notes anywhere! >.<
 

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Just my opinion (and I did see your thread over at ZukiWorld) - you'd probably get more interest there.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the folks here won't be interested - just that it's seems to be a different crowd - with a focus more on repairing & maintaining, rather than modifying & extreme builds.

The ZukiWorld guys are also more into "off-road" mods, which may account for the perceived lack of interest in a slammed & boosted X-90.

One thing makes me curious - the H25 is both longer & wider than the G16 - will you have enough room under the hood for all that - I think it's going to be a tight fit.

Good luck with your build.

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For the curious - here's a link to the thread over at ZukiWorld - what puzzles me is the "apparent lack of interest" remark - thread is six pages long and include input from folks one of whom has swapped the same V6 into a Tracker :confused:
 

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There are only a few posters here who are somewhat familiar with the stock x-90, although the build appears to draw on a number of vehicles. There are a couple of forums (I don't know how good they are) totally devoted to the x-90, like:
x90sontheweb : X90's on the Web - X-90's on the Webs Ya
But yes, fordem is right when he says that this site is more often than not dealing with the stock 1989-1998 Trackicks and dealing with the problems/maintenance that those vehicles have.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
One thing makes me curious - the H25 is both longer & wider than the G16 - will you have enough room under the hood for all that - I think it's going to be a tight fit.

Good luck with your build.

Thanks. I've measured myself and someone else put an H25A in a '92 Tracker. I know the X90 and Tracker are almost identical besides the looks. For example, I just put a/c in my x90. The whole system came from a '98 Tracker. Everything bolted right in. The lines were the correct lenght and the wiring harnesses cliped onto my X-90's harness to the connectors that were hanging there.

I'll hang around here awhile and see if anyone's interested. Should I try the Honda forums instead? :innocent: :lol:

1992 Geo Tracker - 4-Wheel & Off-Road Magazine

 

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Perhaps as you are 'hanging around', you would like to give some info on the car's background? You bought/drove this stock before starting your mods? If so, what did you think of it? I find this such a peculiar little hybrid. You haven't started your project yet? If not, how about some issues that you might have had with the stock x90, how it ran, mileage, etc., and what made you decide to do the mods that you are doing? How does it handle in 4x4, etc., etc.,
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Perhaps as you are 'hanging around', you would like to give some info on the car's background? You bought/drove this stock before starting your mods? If so, what did you think of it? I find this such a peculiar little hybrid. You haven't started your project yet? If not, how about some issues that you might have had with the stock x90, how it ran, mileage, etc., and what made you decide to do the mods that you are doing? How does it handle in 4x4, etc., etc.,
Long story long... I used to own a Chevy Monza built to 400hp and loved the power to weight ratio of small cars with lots of power. It was sold year ago. When I came across some money I wanted to build another small car and bought a '94 Miata. I built a DIY turbo setup that eventually evolved into a T3/T4 hybrid running AEM stand alone engine management and turned about 300hp at the crank. That is what got me into the need for speed again. I had a Miata block prepped and bought rods, pistons, VVT head, ect ect with a goal of 450+ hp in mind but thought I'd never get that power to the ground without all wheel drive. I sold the Miata and bought a '99 Subaru RS from Florida and had it shipped up here to Illinois with the intention of putting Subaru's EZ30R flat-6 into it. Once I learned of Subaru's weak drivetrain and the expense of straight-cut gears, and their noise, I decided against it and sold the Subaru.

I went shopping for a car with one thing in mind. Modifications. I thought about other cars such as Honda Civics and putting an AWD drivetrain in it but they're too common. I wanted something that no one would see coming and that's when the X-90 dawned on me. I remembered when the X-90 came out. The dealership in my home town had one up in the air spinning on a motorized platform and I saw "4x4" on the side of it. I thought that was about the coolest little play toy I'd ever seen but couldn't afford it and forgot all about it until now.

Being that this car came 4x4, it shouldn't be hard to convert it to AWD with the right components. I did much research and chose the X-90 platform for my build. I have owned my X-90 for a little over a year now. It's originally from Montana. I found it on Craigslist. I purchased it from a man in Wisconsin who had recently moved there. I paid $2000 for it. It's 5-speed with 180k miles but the body was clean. For my intentions it was perfect. It's light, it has a frame, the diffs are large enough to handle the power goals and the engine bay looked large enough to accommodate a larger engine. Mine is 2wd but I purchased the front drivetrain components from a '98 Tracker to convert it. The only complication to driving the front wheels is having to weld on the drivers side mount for the front carrier. I have a MIG and have done alot of fab work so that's not a huge issue for me. The other X-90s I looked at were 4x4 and $4000 and up so the $2000 saved more then pays for the drivetrain components required to convert the car back to 4x4.

About the X-90:
The X-90 is built on a Sidekick chassis. Almost everything is interchangable between them except for the bodywork. Many of the interior components will interchange. For example, I put the complete a/c system from a '98 Sidekick into the X-90 and everything was bolt in. I had that done in an afternoon. Very easy to work on. Performance is the same as a Sidekick. It has the 1.6L 16 valve engine. It's peppy but not much use on the interstate. Don't plan on passing anyone.

About my X-90:
1 week after I bought it I lost all the coolant out the front of the engine. Turns out whoever did the water pump left out a bolt and the gasket blew out. I replaced the pump and did the timing while I was in there. It's ran great for me and I love the car but it's bouncy and feels tippy just like a Sidekick. Since it's been lowered it handles great in turns but is still a bit bouncy.

Going out to dinner... back in a bit for any more questions.
 

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I'm familiar with X-90 and it's lineage, and I have little doubt that you can shoe-horn an H25 in there, you can probably put an LS1 in there (there is a thread in here with an LS1 powered Tracker) - but - the picture you so kindly provided shows the point I'm making - with an H25 in there, it doesn't leave much room for anything else.

Front to back it's a tight fit, left to right it's a tight fit - and that's with a normally aspirated H25 - you want to add twin turbos with separate intercoolers - it's going to be a squeeeeze.

Edit - I just took a look at the Petersen article ...

It's going to be a tight fit top to bottom as well - they got rid of the IFS - and as I recall there's not much space between the front diff and the sump on a X90.
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
It's going to be a tight fit top to bottom as well - they got rid of the IFS - and as I recall there's not much space between the front diff and the sump on a X90.
Does that engine looks off center too you? They used the stock intake. When you reverse the intake like I intend to do it makes much more room at the firewall for the engine to be moved back. I wanted to do this anyways to move the shifter back. I'll get a picture of that so you can see what I mean. I've been using my '02 v6 Tracker and the extra v6 engine for measurements. It will definitly fit in there. If you can imagine that picture of the blue H25A Sidekick engine bay without the reservoirs and large air filter you'll see lots of room in front of the strut towers for the turbos. I'll try to position them as low as I can.

There's room for intercooler(s) too. I don't plan on more then 15psi so I won't need some crazy 3 foot wide 1 foot tall IC. The bottom of the bumper has a scoup down there that would direct flow right into a FMIC. I'll get a pic of that in a moment since I have the grill off. The way I'm running the IC piping will be seperate for each turbo. 2 pipes come off the turbos forward to cross over each other through the IC then 2 pipes from the IC back up to the TBs. Each turbo is only feeding 1.25L of engine so I can use much smaller IC piping then you would normally see in say a 4cyl engine. The smaller tubing also allows tighter radius to sneek it around.
 

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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
Bex - I forgot to mention that I bought the X-90 -after- I decided to mod one. I didn't buy the X-90 and think... "wow this thing has no power. I think I'll drop a v6 in it." It was actually the other way around. I wanted to boost a v6 (or H6) in something that was AWD and chose the X-90 as my platform for the build due to it's strenght and weight. I have the engine, harness, turbos, front diff, driveshafts and the will and the money. I still need to source the '06-'08 GV trans and t-case but it will happen. :) I started modding the intake but stopped because I may have to make one. I need the engine in the X-90 before I'll know if my intake plan will clear the hood. I will NOT put a scoop on the hood. :)

Here's a few pics. I'll cut off the bracket for the charcoal canister it will free up a little room but you can see how small these turbos are even in the small X-90 engine bay.

The 2.5L is shorter then the 1.6L and if height becomes an issue I'll dry sump it and make a low profile intake.

Anything worth noting I've marked in red like where the exhaust would run out of the turbine housing and where the IC pipes would go. The one pic of me pointing to where I could notch the bumper has a ford Probe IC stuck down there. With the bumper notched on both sides I could fit two of those Probe ICs down there.

Note in the last pic how the front control arms are just about level. Also look how far the 1.6L pan is from the frame. They could have lowered that engine 4" if they wanted to.

















 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
Here's the pics of the rear of the engine with the stock intake and then reversed. It gives me ~2" more firewall clearance plus the benefit of dual throttle bodies. The lower tube at the back of the heads is a water outlet that feeds back to the front of the engine. That tube sits just above the bell housing and depending on how much clearance is there, and how low I can get the engine, I should be able to set the engine back much further then the image of the blue Tracker v6. As I mentioned before, the reason I have focus on keeping the engine pushed back is because of where I want the shifter inside the vehicle. Anything would be better then the 15" long stick that makes me feel like I'm driving a semi. I'm fairly sure the engine would fit otherwise but that depends on the oil pan and front carrier clearance.





 

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Hmph. The H20A didn't help with his offroading capabilities...;)
 

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Discussion Starter #14
lol I'm sure it has much better off road capabilities but traction is definitely an issue. At least a v6 can spin the mud from the tread. :p
 

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My very light Tracker just glides over the top of the mud. Bit of technique may be useful, too. Barging in like a bull is only good in china shops!
 

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Discussion Starter #16
That wasn't mud, it was soup! My mudding days are over. It was fun back then but getting stuck and the constant cleaning gets old especially when your truck is also your daily driver. Trucks were never my thing.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Another thing I'm considering is getting the '02 cluster into the X-90. That may take some whittling to make it look nice.

First pic is the '02 Tracker and other pics are the X-90.





 

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I was watching the thread on Zukiworld too.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
My '99 Tracker showed up last night so now I can get started on the swap of it's 2.0L into my '02 Tracker. Once the v6 is out of the '02, I can start yanking the X-90's 1.6L and test fit the v6 engine. It will takes it's first steps naturally aspirated. Once I'm satisfied everything is working and running correctly, I'll start on the turbo manifolds, oil, water, and IC plumbing. Those things I can mock up now and install later once the v6's lower end it built. I'll likely source another v6 to build on the side and swap it in next summer.

Anyone need any '99+ Tracker 2-door parts? I have everything but it's drivetrain forsale. The top is shot but everything else looks ok.
 
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