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Introduction and Tire question

5K views 36 replies 9 participants last post by  Rhinoman 
#1 ·
Hello all, FNG here. I recently acquired a 1995 Geo Tracker 2DR 4WD SUV primarily for hunting as many of the trails I run need a 4x4. That and I can't get a deer on the back of my dual sport motorcycle easily AND, the wife won't let me take the AWD Volvo into the woods.:p

I did a lot of searching on tire sizes and types and have determined that the BF Goodrich AT T/A KO or KM2s will fit the bill. Because they are 215s they have a larger profile than the OEM recommended 205s. I've seen some posts where this has not been an issue and some where it has but nothing conclusive. This vehicle is completely stock with no aftermarket mods other than the PO put some stickers on it...don't stickers make it go faster?:D

So my question is, will I have to do any mods or, will the 215/75R15s fit with out any problems? :confused: Also, since I will use this both on and off road, which is recommended, the KO or KM2?

I like the look of the KM2 but not sure how well it will handle on-road as the hunt club is 2 hrs drive from me and I will drive this as a DD every now and again.
 
#2 ·
I don't know about KO or KM2, but your car will handle the 215/75/15's with no problem, on the stock rims.
You can normally go up to 225/75/15 - although the stock rim is .5" too narrow for them, as per manufacturer spec (although that's what I ride with no problem). Some people have had rubbing issues with the 235's.....
 
#4 ·
Thanks for the responses. Any noticeable changes to steering and handling with the larger tires?

I am hoping to fix my belt squeal issue this weekend as well as track down the 'card in the bicycle spoke' sound from the left front wheel. I did discover that the PO had put electrical tape over the top of the clear instrument cluster visor to block out the check engine light that is on. :mad: Dumbass.

I'll run the OBD checks then re-set it later today. I need to run to Pick N Pull first to pull a window regulator motor and power antenna for my son's Honda Accord. Replaced his steering wheel and airbag yesterday to the tune of $50. Dealership wanted to charge the boy $1100.:eek: I have no confidence in them as the 'technician' didn't know that to change a front rotor on a 92 Honda Accord you have to...wait for it...'1. remove steering knuckle.' :lol: That was a royal PITA!
 
#7 ·
... I did discover that the PO had put electrical tape over the top of the clear instrument cluster visor to block out the check engine light that is on. :mad: Dumbass.
I have seen MUCH worse... You have been PO'ed! :p

... that to change a front rotor on a 92 Honda Accord you have to...wait for it...'1. remove steering knuckle.' :lol: That was a royal PITA!
I have seen designs that you need to do that.... I own a few. While I understand why the design ended up like this, it is a very dumb design.

Similar dumb designs are all over the place... For my Malibu, the first step in changing the headlight BULB is: "Remove the front bumper." :eek:
 
#5 ·
Personally, I had no steering or handling issues going up to the 225's. The speedometer indicates about 4% slower than my actual speed, and the 225's look nice in the wheel wells (where I think the 205's look a bit small).
Regarding your bicycle wheel sound, do you have manual or auto hubs? Hopefully manual.....these need to be serviced each year. And remember, this car is part time 4wd - it should never be driven on dry surfaces with car in 4wd and hubs locked.....
 
#6 ·
It is a 5 SPD Manual, no, I never drive on pavement in 4wd. I will get my factory service manual tomorrow and look up the servicing procedures for the hub along with some other minor issues. All in all, she runs very smoothly.
 
#10 ·
Not properly or without running the risk of damage. You can often find the tool on ebay - some aftermarket companies as well, although there have been reports on difficulties with some of them.
 
#11 ·
I was afraid you were going to say that.:( Guess I'll go and find one since I plan on keeping this car for a while. I was watching a youtube video of a guy replacing a bearing on a 94 Tracker. He pressed out the race as well for the repair, is this necessary? I would assume if the race is torn up then you should replace it but I would rather not go through the hassle of pressing one out and then pressing a new one in.
 
#13 ·
Also, since I will use this both on and off road, which is recommended, the KO or KM2?

I like the look of the KM2 but not sure how well it will handle on-road as the hunt club is 2 hrs drive from me and I will drive this as a DD every now and again.
I would recommend the KM2. I had sets of both the KO and KM's, both of them were excellent tires, however for off road driving the KM's were much better. A little louder on the highway but not too much in my opinion. I had about 60k on them. Two still had 9/32 tread, the other two were bald only because I ran them on the front axle while out of alignment for a while. The KM2 that replaced the KM should be even better, if that's possible.
 
#16 ·
Manual Body bolt torque - 106 ft lbs?

OK, so I got the special tool for the locking nut yesterday and tore into both front hubs today. After pulling the wheels, caliper, rotors and manual locking hub assembly I was able to get the retaining washer off without a problem.

Then I put the tool on the hub locking retainer and...she spins easily BY HAND!:eek: BOTH SIDES! The FSM says they are supposed to be torqued at 155 ft lbs, these weren't even close!

Pulled both hubs, they came off way too easy, and cleaned them up and lo and behold, we have an issue with the left hub.
View attachment 31418
As you can see, it is a bit deformed. This makes getting the new seal in damn difficult! No, I ain't gonna replace the assembly if I don't have to. If I can get the seal in without damaging it then we'll keep going until next time I gotta do this.

So now to the question, FSM says the hub body bolts are too be torqued at 106 ft. lbs. Is this correct? This seems awfully tight for these small bolts. Can someone confirm for me? Last thing I want to do is strip these suckers in the hub.
 
#22 ·
Then I put the tool on the hub locking retainer and...she spins easily BY HAND!:eek: BOTH SIDES! The FSM says they are supposed to be torqued at 155 ft lbs, these weren't even close!
It's the wheel bearing locknut itself that is torqued to 155 ft/lbs.

And x2 to Aqua's suggestion to dump the Haynes or Chiltons - they have loads of misinformation - at least for these cars. Search the forum and see posters with incorrect timing issues, torque issues, etc., because of these rags. If you do not have a proper Suzuki FSM, go to Acks FAQS and download the chapters of the official Geo Tracker FSM that's free to download - note that this is for the 1996 Trackick, which will have some differences, but torques will be the same.

And yes, it is a misprint - 12Nm is 106 INCH pounds (and is correct on splash shield bolts. 1 Newton meter = 8.85 inch pounds, or .737 foot pounds.

If you have the stock locking hubs (Aisin) you can use the springs from any Toyota Hilux or Isuzu 4wd with Aisins. They are interchangeable. Or find the hubs in a junkyard. My springs are not from a Suzuki, and work well.
 
#18 ·
Nope. Per page 3C-9 of the FSM
"Tighten.
* Manual locking hub body bolts to 25 Nm (18 lb.ft.)

* Manual locking hub cover bolts tyo 12 Nm (106 lb. ft.)"

As you can see the second set of specs is off. 12 Nm is actually only 8 lb. ft. NOT 106 lb. ft.! Anyone got a Haynes or Chilton and can tell me what it says?
 
#20 ·
Never had a problem with Haynes or Chilton being incorrect, usually, they don't give enough info. I did the calculation to inch lbs and 12 Nm is 106.21 inch lbs soooo, I am guessing the lb. ft. is a typo in the FSM. I'll go with 8.

Before I finish that off though I'm gonna have to clean up the locking hubs. They have all kinds of grit and metal rust in them despite being covered in grease. It's like the PO drover her into a salt lake then let her sit for a salt bath.:huh: Guess i'll work on that today and then get it all put back together...in the rain.:( Not like I haven't worked in crappy conditions before, 30 years in the Army has had its challenging work conditions:D
 
#21 ·
Well....crap.

And the hits just keep on coming!:mad:

So I pulled the hub cap off the hub and started to clean up the spring and retainer. Wow, she's REALLY DIRTY! As I dig deeper into the morass of grease, rust and grit it becomes glaringly apparent that these hubs haven't seen a service since the vehicle was acquired and, they are beyond service and repair.:mad::mad::mad::mad:

The innards are so damn rusted that there are sections of the metal spring retainer that are exceptionally thin and the spring is toast. Dangit! Guess I'll be ordering some new locking hubs. I'm trying to search around now to see if I can find any locking hubs locally but I am resigning myself to the fact that I will probably have to order them online and wait.

Guess, I'll finish getting the other hub assembly put back together and on the truck then cover both sides with garbage bags to keep them out of the elements. I guess this means I will be starting early on fixing my son's Jeep Grand Cherokee. I am doing a transfer case swap and so need to drop the case from my son's Jeep. I already have a new case but I need to check input shaft length to see if I need to swap the shafts.
 
#25 ·
That's just silly talk! :p Time to retire and buy a house with a bigger garage! Need room for a Ural Motorcycle, Sport bike for the track and a Ferrari as my next project car:D Guess I better start playing the lottery:lol:
 
#26 ·
Been there, done that...

Down to 2 SUV's, a M/C, hauler trailer and RV.... a big garage full of tools.... walking room only...

Teasing wife the other day, next gig, a fully enclosed GyroCopter.

.... Philip
 
#27 ·
Back on the road!

ALRIGHTY THEN! Got the Rugged Ridge locking hubs yesterday and, after a call to them, discovered they DON'T come with the gasket between the locking hub and the hub assembly.:confused: Not sure why but they don't. No problem, ran over to O'Reilly's and picked up some gasket material, got out the scissors, exacto blade and hole punch and...voila! New gaskets.:D

So, got it all assembled and took the dog to the doggie play park for its drive after installing new bearings and locking hubs...wow, what a difference! She rides so much quieter and smoother with the new bearings and I don't feel the 'pulling' as if someone is trying to hold me back that I did before. I like it!:460:

So, what next? I have to adjust the passenger window as it is coming out of its track but I also still have a rather annoying rattle/buzzing sound coming from the drive train. I thought I fixed it when I secured the plate that sits between the motor and gearbox but I guess I either didn't secure it well enough or, there is another issue.

Anyone experience this? If you listen to a table saw wind down after you flip it off you sometimes here a slight rattle if the blade needs tightening. This is as close a description as I can figure out for the noise. It mostly does this on acceleration and stops when I engage the clutch then starts again. It usually goes away at speed but every now and again I will here it as I drive down the road.

I will try to get a sound recording of it when I head home from the office today and post it. Any thoughts or recommendations would be appreciated, it looks like a bit of a bear to separate the tranny from the motor, not nearly as easy as doing it on my Porsche.
 
#28 ·
First, I must say I really enjoyed this:

" Other than rust, everything else is solid. "

What a hoot! My car is the same - I'm having the crossmembers of my chassis rebuilt next week - having had the rear of the frame completely re-done last week, and hopefully, at least this part will be solid. (And no, Aqua, I wouldn't attempt welding the frame and, I must admit, my welding on thin gauge is truly abominable.....:( )

Anyway, I suggest that you get under the car and just heartily manhandle everything - particularly the u-joints if you are getting a rattling with a load on the engine. You should have no movement anywhere. A good time to check the suspension, etc., as well - I just replaced my center link last week, after the bushings took a dive after 22 years....Hopefully your rattle is from something easily visible....

I had to make my own gaskets for the hubs, as well - not really easy with all those curves and holes, but certainly doable.

Regarding the passenger window - hopefully the bracket at the bottom of the glass just needs to be tightened and/or the glass balanced. You will need to raise/lower the window probably a number of times to get the balance just right, so that the window goes up straight.

Glad you're enjoying your new locking hubs.....!!
 
#29 ·
What??? :confused: Why are ya laughing??? :D Looks like mostly surface rust with the biggest offender being on the control arms. I do need to start knocking it off and do a really good inspection.

I did determine that the rattling sound manifests itself right at around 2200 rpm on both acceleration and deceleration. I'll try to get her up on the rack this weekend if I finish the other couple of projects first.
 
#32 ·
OK, I crawled up under her yesterday to check transmission fluid level and status. She is full but the gear oil stinks and is black. Good sign it will need replacing, guess what I will be doing this week.

I also checked for anything that might be loose and create the rattle sound, nothing but the sound has quieted down a lot as of late. Not sure if this is good or bad.

Finally, I pulled the passenger wide window and regulator out, cleaned up the regulator, re-greased and reinstalled. I need to make a minor adjustment to get it to seal all the way in the front but I no longer have an issue with the window going up and binding.

All in all, progress is being made. I will tackle little projects on this one as opposed to the major rebuilds I am doing on my other vehicles. Now I just gotta finish my son's transfer case rebuild so I can get his vehicle up and running and out of my dang driveway!:rolleyes:
 
#33 ·
"...but the gear oil stinks and is black. ..."

If the stink is a sulphur smell, it might have the incorrect gear oil in the transfer case and manual transmission. The sulphur smell of non-synthetic hypoid gear oil, is VERY strong and isn't good for the transmission.

To explain: With non-synthetic oils they put in a sulphur based additive to make the gear oil "more slippery" for hypoid gears of the differential. This is "GL5" and should NOT be used in anything with yellow metals... like our transfer cases and manual transmissions. GL-5 is not necessarily backward-compatible in synchro-mesh transmissions which are designed for a GL-4 oil. Items with yellow metals should get GL4 or a synthetic GL4/GL5 gear oil. Synthetic GL4/GL5 gear oil is slippery enough to meet the GL5 standard without the Sulpher additives that will damage the yellow metal parts (bushings and synchronizers) of the transmission.

If you search the net you'll find many different, conflicting, opinions about this. But I follow the manual, ie: Stinky stuff in the diffs, non-stinky stuff in the transfer case. I do not do manuals, but if I did, they wouldn't get stinky stuff.
 
#34 ·
I know what sulfur smells like and I don't think that this is the smell. FSM says 75 90W GL4 which is what I picked up at O'Reilly's. I think my 901 gearbox out of my Porsche uses almost identical gear oil to the tracker. I will take a look at the stuff I just picked up and make sure it is right before I put it in.
 
#35 ·
She's been baptized!

OK, I changed out the gearbox fluid last week, shifts like a dream and easily slips into gear in the mornings now. Before you'd have to warm her up a bit and run through 2-5 before she would go into 1 and reverse. So all is good!:D

Went down to NC to my hunt club and linked up with the in-laws to go Turkey hunting as the season opened this past Saturday. Had em gobbling all around us but we just couldn't get them to come in. :(

We came out for some chow then went scouting to see if we could scare up some lonely Toms...then the trouble started!:rolleyes:

After running successfully through four mud pits along the one route into NC gameland I didn't quite get enough speed on the way back on the one mud hole and she lost traction.
View attachment 31969
View attachment 31977
View attachment 31985

So the bro in law called his dad and walked a mile out to the road to meet him with his Suburban to pull me out. Meanwhile, I kept trying to get un-stuck and eventually got enough wood under the wheels to move out of the major puddle. Unfortunately, she bottomed out and although I was out of most of it, she was buried up to the frame rails so wouldn't budge anymore.

Karma being a bitch, pops mis-reads the first mud puddle on the way into where I am at. Yup, you guessed it, he gets the Suburban stuck. :lol: It was payback for laughing at us!:harhar:

Bro in law calls, 'hey, tell Cathy (my wife) to call me.' She calls then gets in the car an picks up her dad at the road. They go back and get HIS truck which is a monster Ford 350 with a fifth wheel to haul their behemoth RV trailer. He comes back and pulls out the Suburban then they get back in the Suburban and finally make it back to me.

By this time I'm covered in mud as I have been trying to dig out the undercarriage so no damage occurs when they pull her out. Hook up a chain, pop everything into neutral and she pulls right out. The Suburban is a K2500 4x4 heavy duty so it has no problem pulling me out.:bwekk:

And this is what she looks like after the adventure.
View attachment 31993

There is also a lot of mud in the drivers side compartment. I'm thinking...pull carpets and Rhino line the entire bottom of the interior! Of course, if'n I had the AT tires already on this might not have happened!:whistling:

Got me thinking though, has anyone put a winch on their truck and if so, what type and, where did you attach it?
 
#36 ·
Yes, some people have put special winch bumpers and winches on their Trackicks - if you search the forum, you should find posts about them....
 
#37 ·
I have an 8000lb winch fitted to a UK made winch bumper. The winch is just a cheap Chinese model but it is adequate as long as care is taken not to overheat it.
 
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