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Discussion Starter #1
Hey guys so my rig is a 1.8 sport and I've been chasing ghosts trying to figure out a misfiring problem. So the problem is on cooler days (below 0*C) when the truck warms up at around 1100 RPM (when the coolant temp gauge starts moving) the truck misfires horribly (as if the engine cuts out for a split second). I have attempted to remedy the problem by replacing the spark plugs and ignition coils (which were arcing really bad). When the truck warms up and hits 800 rpm it runs just fine. The misfire only occurs at idle. And no it never threw me a CEL (I know it works as I see it light up when I put the key in and see the dash lights). My code reader found nothing either. What causes this?
 

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99 Tracker, 5 door, 2L, 4x4
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96 and newer, use a Live data scanner instead of the code reader....

Do a basic OBDII scan, take careful attention to engine temp (what the ECU sees), the fuel trim...and what the O2 sensor does when first comes on line...

.... Philip
 

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x2 for having a scanner, rather than just a code reader. The scanner will show you exactly what the car is doing, rather than a code reader which only shows what codes the check engine light is indicating.
If you can get your hands on a scanner, you can then post the readout so that people can see the information and give you better help. Normally, if you have a misfire, which is what you are assuming that this is, the ECU will pick this up, so it is possible that your problem lies elsewhere.
By the way, some info on your coil packs here, as well as a link to the electrical diagram for them on Acks Faqs:
http://www.suzuki-forums.com/suzuki...nteresting-question-about-coil-packs-1-a.html
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I started that thread and i learnt a lot about the ignition systems in these trucks. i dont think i can get access to a live feed scanner though but i think it would provide a lot of insight to what is going on in there. my next guess would be the cam and crank sensor or the ignition module.
 

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Sorry, cant help if I get no data..

Your $$$, in the swap parts guessing game...

.... Philip
 

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Keep an eye on the coolant temperature as it warms up, the O2 sensor will usually come on-line around 50 degrees C if the IAT is high enough.
 

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Rhino, thanks for clarifying post #2, unfortunately the OP reports, cannot access this info...

..... Philip
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
One question if I were to buy a live data scanner. Are these things inexpensive enough for an average joe to acquire?If yes then what models are you guys using? If not il guess i will have to go find a shop that has one and get the truck to replicate the problem (it only does this on a cold start and warming up). I have to agree with Aquanaut though playing the swap part guessing game isn't the way to go and will only extend this "ghost chase"
 

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Have an MS509, MD802 and an android phone with the Torque app/OBDII module (BT), all work well.

Because of my failing eyes (getting old). And because I needed a new toy to keep me occupied...

I have migrated to a 7"android Tablet ($53.00), The Torque Pro (5.00) and a WiFi OBDII module (19.00).

your choice....

....Philip
 

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Discussion Starter #11
ok so now that i got my overheating issue out of the way. im resurrecting this thread. I now have a live data scan tool (Autel AL519). it gives me long fuel trim and short fuel trim. also i do have the readout for the O2 sensors and ignition timing. what should those be at normally?
 

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ok so now that i got my overheating issue out of the way. im resurrecting this thread. I now have a live data scan tool (Autel AL519). it gives me long fuel trim and short fuel trim. also i do have the readout for the O2 sensors and ignition timing. what should those be at normally?
Oh! how wonderful if you could master the "SEARCH" function..

I have posted many, many times how to run a basic OBDII test....

.... Philip
 

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If you download the FSM from acksfaq.com it has a table of expected values. Note that ignition timing is calculated ignition timing and it assumes that the base timing is correctly set.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Ok so I ran some tests with my AL519. What I noticed was the o2 sensor 1 reads 0 off. Voltage going randomly between 0.1 and 0.88 at idle and at rpm and on deaceleration goes below 0.1. Then resumes with the random pattern. O2 sensor 2 sits at 0.31 regardless of what the engine is doing. Running the I/M tests I got X's on EGR 02 and cat. So maybe my problems are from there.
 

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Ok so I ran some tests with my AL519. What I noticed was the o2 sensor 1 reads 0 off. Voltage going randomly between 0.1 and 0.88 at idle and at rpm and on deaceleration goes below 0.1. Then resumes with the random pattern. O2 sensor 2 sits at 0.31 regardless of what the engine is doing. Running the I/M tests I got X's on EGR 02 and cat. So maybe my problems are from there.
The ECU use the data from the upstream O2 sensor to adjust the fuel trim to spec 14.7/1.
The O2 should switch actively and without any bias....
The down stream O2 sensor monitors the gasses post cat, if the cat is functioning the reading will remain fairly stable..

The X may signify that your ECU does not support these tests, generally if the test has not completed you should see "Inc", or "fail" if the test does not meet requirements..

However all these components can be tested with the results affecting the FT and/or O2 graph...

.....Philip
 

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The front o2 is supposed to cycle between 0.1 and 0.9 volts. The rear o2 does not cycle at all, it just reads the exhaust gas.
I would assume that if you had an actual cylinder misfire, your scanner should be picking this up. What kind of driving do you do in this car? I understand that the lifters in the 1.8 are self adjusting - other posters have advised that you should drive the car, or let it idle at 2000 rpm for 30 minutes for the lifters to self-adjust.
It might be a good idea for you to post the complete read-out that you are getting from the scanner, so that others can see the total picture.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
it will only do this on colder days, as the engine is warming up. il fire it up today and il see if the scanner picks up anything. il get a set of numbers from cold idle. and bex yes the sensor is cycling (graph goes up and down at random intervals between 0.1 and 0.88).

The FSM from Acks only has info for the 1.6 or the 2L J20/2.5L V6
 

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BEX: His lifters are hydraulic and should pump up as soon as engine oil pressure is up..1-2sec....otherwise the timing chain will slap...

I see he is in good hands now, time for me to back out... Cheers

..... Philip
 

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Discussion Starter #20
IMG_1428.jpg

IMG_1429.jpg
Ok i have some results from the scantool.

sometimes these misfireing "blips" are too fast for the scanner to pick up but when it does here is what i found.
there is a trouble code that keeps coming back (in attachments)

I have more attachments
 
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