When I am cranking the motor it is still flashing 12. Code 12 should be one long flash and 2 short flashes, right? It just keeps flashing it over and over. I was looking at the fusebox diagrams and ive seen a few ones that differ from each other. Some have the diagnostic fuse as the fi fuse in the same spot. Ill order a noise suppressor but I find it very odd that all of this happened without warning.
1990 Tracker crank no start
I have a 1990 tracker with the 5 speed manual and 4x4. The other day I was idling in my tracker and it just shut off. After getting a tow I did a lot of research on here and I keep coming to dead ends.
My issues so far are as follows:
-No fuel coming from injector yet the fuel pump is ok after testing it. Fuel is getting to the throttlebody
-Noid light test gave no pulse signal.
-Tach is not moving when cranking over the engine.
-Engine will only run off starting fluid. Tach will work when the engine is running off of starter fluid.
-ECM is repeatedly flashing code 12- flipping that hidden switch does nothing.
-TPS readings are within normal limits.
-Injector is within spec
I had new capacitors put on my ECM and im still having these issues. Should I just spend the money on a new ECU?
Any help would be appreciated thanks.
My issues so far are as follows:
-No fuel coming from injector yet the fuel pump is ok after testing it. Fuel is getting to the throttlebody
-Noid light test gave no pulse signal.
-Tach is not moving when cranking over the engine.
-Engine will only run off starting fluid. Tach will work when the engine is running off of starter fluid.
-ECM is repeatedly flashing code 12- flipping that hidden switch does nothing.
-TPS readings are within normal limits.
-Injector is within spec
I had new capacitors put on my ECM and im still having these issues. Should I just spend the money on a new ECU?
Any help would be appreciated thanks.
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alright, ill give that a shot. thanksIf you can see the 12 flashing on the CEL, the jumper or diagnostic fuse is in the correct place. If I recall correctly, the '89 & '90 models have "stand alone" distributors that do not need the ECU to produce a spark, so on those models the ECU only handles the fuel injection - it still needs to see the CAS (crank angle sensor) signal to be able to inject the fuel, but if that's missing you should see a 42 code.
Disconnect the battery, unplug the ECU and then verify continuity on the wiring between the injector and the ECU.
No drive to the injector without a 41 or 42 code would suggest either the ECU or the ECU to injector wiring is where the problem lies.
Alright I did some testing. It wont throw any other code than 12 and I do have continuity on both injector wires. Is it time to shell out the cash for a new ecu?If you can see the 12 flashing on the CEL, the jumper or diagnostic fuse is in the correct place. If I recall correctly, the '89 & '90 models have "stand alone" distributors that do not need the ECU to produce a spark, so on those models the ECU only handles the fuel injection - it still needs to see the CAS (crank angle sensor) signal to be able to inject the fuel, but if that's missing you should see a 42 code.
Disconnect the battery, unplug the ECU and then verify continuity on the wiring between the injector and the ECU.
No drive to the injector without a 41 or 42 code would suggest either the ECU or the ECU to injector wiring is where the problem lies.
yea unfortunatly i dont have a scope so ill have to take my chances with a new ecuWell, if it were me, I would want to hang a scope on the injector output and the cam angle input, but not everyone has access to a scope, so I guess if you can get your hands on an ECU, that would be the way to go.
Thanks for the advice. I will have to try testing this with a multimeter when I get some free time. Visually the transistors dont look fried but looks can be deceiving.If the noid test gives no signal, it is possible that the injector driver in the ECU has fried (and can be replaced). Normally this will happen due to a short in the injector wiring. Before trying to find a new ECU, open your ECU up and take a look.
See post #6 here, and follow the top link in that post (bottom link won’t work)
No noid When Loaded
Good Day, I`m working on My son`s 92 8v, auto, 4x4, 2dr, tracker. I`ve read the kick fix pages (very helpfull). I have noid light when connected only to the plug, No noid light when the injector is connected as well. Is it safe to Assume I`ve lost 1 injector driver on the ECM? I`ve tested...www.suzuki-forums.com
If the transistors are shot, is there any good place to get some replacement transistors?
i noticed that my board is labelled differently from yours though i doubt it would matter. visually, they look fine, no rubycon caps on this board anymore.Open up your ECU, and first see if the original Rubycon capacitors are still there. Some people have advised that they still get the code 12, even though one or two of the caps have failed.
Regarding the injector drivers, you are looking for Q101, etc.
View attachment 110482
Ok, I just probed the transistors with a multimeter after looking up a tutorial (new to this). I used a multimeter with a "diode mode" and probed each one. Every transistor gave me a value except D112 in your picture (just gave me OL). That one is labelled as D15 in my board. One side seems to be dead. Another thing, reversing the leads on Q100 was the only way I could get a reading on one of the sides. Crap multimeter?Open up your ECU, and first see if the original Rubycon capacitors are still there. Some people have advised that they still get the code 12, even though one or two of the caps have failed.
Regarding the injector drivers, you are looking for Q101, etc.
View attachment 110482
Wow just read through all of that. Must have been a huge headache for youI don’t know much about this either, other than the fact that I have had what potentially may be a similar situation. Start reading here at post #21…..regarding the tests I was instructed to do
electrical short??
I had originally made an appointment with my mechanic as I had a short somewhere in my 91 Tracker. It started with the radio cutting out when I put on the brakes, indicators or hit a bump. Then the brake lights stopped working completely. In the meantime (when it rains, it pours) my ECU went...
. Think I might just redo injector wiring as a precautionary measure and grab a new computer. I plan on eventually redoing my current ecm but I dont think I have the skillset for it at the moment.
Yep, i left the key on and it was still code 12. I did find an ecu and man, they are expensive. I did order it and it claims it's remanned with a 5 year warranty. I called my local electronics repair shop and I've never heard someone so eager to tell me that they don't do that kind of "low level work" anymore (that is what he actually said too).Finding a 1990 ECU might be a bit of an adventure. If you are unsure how to check to see if the injector drivers are good or not, most computer geeks will be able to do this….they’ll be able to check your caps and board, as well.
And going back to Fordem’s advice in post #2, when you are cranking, you’re advising you get a code 12. The way Fordem’s test works is that when you stop cranking, you leave the key in the on position, and then check to see if the code changes to 41 or 42. Did you leave the key on??
When i had opened the board it was also apparent that acid corrosion had taken its toll. It was cleaned up but connections on the board were getting bridged, so i think it would take a lot of love to save that ecm
That's a good point. I am aware that there's differing ecm's based on the country that its in which makes it even more of a wild goose chase with finding the correct computer. And yea, back to the repair shop, I wasn't really expecting them to be able to work on it. Kind of a shot in the dark ya know. Just wish these little computers weren't so hard to find, and I had no idea on the scarcity of parts with the '89s and '90s prior to buying one. You live and learn lol.To be honest, I don't see any "local electronics repair shops" as being willing to take on motor vehicle ECU repair work, it's more of a specialist field.
Apart from the basic electrical/electronics training, which you would expect any electronics tech to have, diagnosis of a fault requires an "in depth understanding" of what the "module" you're working on does (which is information that no vehicle manufacturer makes available) - you'll need to know, and be able to provide, the various inputs the module requires, and what outputs to expect (my instructor referred to these as the "gosinta" & comesouta"), and these are going to vary from one vehicle model to the next, and from one market to the next - as an example my Africa market J20a engined, 5 speed second gen is VERY different to a US market J20a engined, 5 speed second gen - mine has no O2 sensor, no MAP sensor, no knock sensor, and no EGR, all of which are there on a US market model (the knock sensor is year dependent), what my car does have that the US ones don't, is a 10 turn potentiometer known as "CO adjuster", along with a very different EPROM program.
Short of building a simulator for each version of each ECU, you really need to have the vehicle on hand to test the ECU, and few people are going to take that on as a job and offer a warranty on the work done.
Given the revenue that can be generated and the risk of litigation and/or reputational damage involved, the answer is going to be "No, we don't work on those".
Yea I just picked one up with a warrenty. I would have had it running by now but i had to send a supposedly rebuilt one back as the caps werent replaced and the board was burnt!There are a lot of rebuilt ECUs on EBAY. That's where I found mine. Most are re-built -- so it appears that a lot of people think it's worthwhile. Finding the exact one for your rig shouldn't be too difficult. Just make sure it comes with a warranty of some sort.
Where did you end up putting that injector fuse in the circuit?Perhaps a moot point now, but the computer ‘geek’ in my local town was able to replace my caps, test and replace the injector drivers, clean the traces, etc., in my ECU, as well as make a recommendation to run an inline inline fuse in the injector wiring circuit so that, if the injector wires caused more problems, the fuse would blow well before any damage to the ECU. Then again, he was building computers, and not just some guy in an electronics shop.
I'll have to do that then, thank youOn the red injector wire, between the injector and the ECU, just after where it goes through the connector shared by the TPS.
Yea the one I ordered a few days ago was about $525YIKES!!! I guess I'm lucky I have a '91 -- but there is quite a variation in price.
Update to this thread:
Put the new ecm in and still wont start. No fuel spraying from injector still and no signal. Kind of out of ideas here.
I did probe voltage off of the tps and nothing seems right there either. Ranges are way off and dont make any sense.
Put the new ecm in and still wont start. No fuel spraying from injector still and no signal. Kind of out of ideas here.
I did probe voltage off of the tps and nothing seems right there either. Ranges are way off and dont make any sense.
The pump is working and can be jumped. When I crank it I can hear it. I know fuel is getting to the TB also. I got 8 volts off of my TPS signal wire and 6 volts at wide open throttle and I dont know how thats possible. Gonna assume the throttle pos sensor is FUBAR.My tracker’s in-tank fuel pump had ingested the old “plastic” fuel strainer/screen and quit working. If you use jumper wires from batt to fuel pump wires will it run? I’m to old to understand the computer s—t. New fuel pump and fuel strainer/screen and all has worked since the repair. Not sure I’ve helped but good luck. I too had previously replaced the “fried” ECM.
Another thing, shouldnt it run without the tps plugged in? Theres also a good chance I measured it incorrectly as I couldnt find much on how to get the voltage measurment off of it. I have a 4 wire TPS and the harness plug looks like it has wires going to the idle air control switch.This is something that needs to be investigated, there are either three or four wires to the throttle position sensor (some years have an "idle switch), the other three are the reference voltage (5v), ground (0V) and the "signal" wire (voltage varies with the position of the throttle).
The sensor is nothing more than a variable resistor, the voltage possible on the signal wire cannot exceed the reference 5V, the "extra voltage" would have to come from somewhere, the ECU, a short in the wiring, or an incorrect measurement technique
Alright I will have to properly check that then.Based on the manual I'm looking at, the two additional wires in the TPS harness connector are for the injector, so, no, the engine won't run with that disconnected.
I have no "hands on" experience with the 8v TBI systems, we didn't get them, our 8v models came with a carburettor, but the basic principles of fuel injection system will still hold.
View attachment 110613
This diagram is taken from a Suzuki FSM, I don't guarantee it'll match your Tracker, but it should be similar, I don't know if you have the tools to back probe connectors, and I don't know if the Suzuki connectors allow the use of back probes, not all manufacturers use connectors that do - #5 is your throttle position sensor.
"Back probing" is the technique of inserting a test meter probe, usually a very thin probe, into the back or "wire side" of a connector so that you can make measurements whilst the connector is connected to the device. In the absence of back probes some people use needles or tee pins to puncture the insulation on the wires, if you do this you need to make sure the needles/pins cannot short to one another or to any adjacent metal, and you need to seal the punctures afterwards using something like liquid electrical tape. If moisture gets into those punctures it will corrode the copper inside the insulation, and cause problems down the road that will be very difficult to locate.
Meter on 20 VDC scale (assuming a digital meter, but any meter that can measure 12VDC can be used - my preference for this is an old style analog meter, I'll explain why in a minute)
Black meter probe to GND, which is a grey wire with yellow stripe.
Red meter probe first to TPS In, which is a grey wire with red stripe, you should be seeing 5V or close to that.
Red meter probe next to TPS Out, which is a grey wire with no stripe, the voltage here should be between 0V and 5V and should vary smoothly as the throttle is opened & closed, with digital meters, the readings tend to jump around, with analog meters the smooth swing of the needle is easier to see, if you can see the needle flickering, jumping either to 5V or to 0v, it means the wiper in the TPS is loosing contact with the traces inside, and the TPS is defective.
Alright, tested the tps and its fine. Kinda at a loss here on where to go next. Looks like my injector is also wired separatly from the tps also. On the left in my picture is the tps and on the right is the injector.Based on the manual I'm looking at, the two additional wires in the TPS harness connector are for the injector, so, no, the engine won't run with that disconnected.
I have no "hands on" experience with the 8v TBI systems, we didn't get them, our 8v models came with a carburettor, but the basic principles of fuel injection system will still hold.
View attachment 110613
This diagram is taken from a Suzuki FSM, I don't guarantee it'll match your Tracker, but it should be similar, I don't know if you have the tools to back probe connectors, and I don't know if the Suzuki connectors allow the use of back probes, not all manufacturers use connectors that do - #5 is your throttle position sensor.
"Back probing" is the technique of inserting a test meter probe, usually a very thin probe, into the back or "wire side" of a connector so that you can make measurements whilst the connector is connected to the device. In the absence of back probes some people use needles or tee pins to puncture the insulation on the wires, if you do this you need to make sure the needles/pins cannot short to one another or to any adjacent metal, and you need to seal the punctures afterwards using something like liquid electrical tape. If moisture gets into those punctures it will corrode the copper inside the insulation, and cause problems down the road that will be very difficult to locate.
Meter on 20 VDC scale (assuming a digital meter, but any meter that can measure 12VDC can be used - my preference for this is an old style analog meter, I'll explain why in a minute)
Black meter probe to GND, which is a grey wire with yellow stripe.
Red meter probe first to TPS In, which is a grey wire with red stripe, you should be seeing 5V or close to that.
Red meter probe next to TPS Out, which is a grey wire with no stripe, the voltage here should be between 0V and 5V and should vary smoothly as the throttle is opened & closed, with digital meters, the readings tend to jump around, with analog meters the smooth swing of the needle is easier to see, if you can see the needle flickering, jumping either to 5V or to 0v, it means the wiper in the TPS is loosing contact with the traces inside, and the TPS is defective.
1 - 20 of 63 Posts
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