rough idle post alt drive and ac drive belt replacement

[centexn]

Hi everyone...



1995 sidekick 1.6l 16v 112k jlx

Replaced both drive belts after losing battery power underway..and limping home after dark by keeping lights and accessories off. strange behavior...before no acceleration issues..nice and even throttle response without bogging...good gas econ. Now after about 48 hrs with thee belts on...is it possible I would need to clear CEL due to the depletion of the battery to "reprogram" the computer? baffling..to say the least since car ran smoothe as silk before the battery fail. Batter takes a charge just fine.. Commennts would be appreciated...

centexn

[Bex]

If your check engine light is on with the key on, and off once the car runs, jump the diagnostic connector and get whatever codes are in there, then remove the dome light fuse for a minute to reset the computer. Then see if any codes come back. The ECU does not like low voltage, but from a forum, there is no way of knowing if your battery problem/installation, etc., caused ECU issues - clear your codes and then report if the CEL remains on.

[centexn]

Bex//

Thanks for the response and I will do just that. The f9llowing info may be pertinent. CEL been on for awhile. Have not jumped before as vehicle was running w/o apparent issues. Smooth performance and testing mpg @ 2500 rpm resulted in about 28+ mpg. So I left if as it was. Been running this way for at least 6 mo. Hope I havent shot myself in the foot.

[Bex]

Normally, the CEL really isn't something that should be ignored. Most often, it is the computer trying to tell you something. There is also the possibility that this could be the 'service engine soon' function of the CEL, if the light went on at an even mileage, like 100,000 miles, etc. If the SES function is on, you will be unable to pull codes until you flip the SES switch, located in your car behind the dash, probably by the left speaker. See if you can get a code first, and if not post, and we can give you instructions on how to turn off the SES. If you can get codes, post them for more info.

[xxx]

you never stated the issues only this.

is it possible I would need to clear CEL due to the depletion of the battery to "reprogram" the computer? baffling.

oops squawk is only in the title "rough idle?" that is misfire at idle. (most likely too rich AFR misfire at idle)
but is that the only symptom hot and cold engine. or is it only out of gear or driving... tell the good and the bad for best answers, pretend we cant drive your car.

No the ecu does not need reprogramming, (it cant be done, stock parts)
yes, pull the codes
yes, write them down.
yes, pull dome fuse ,wait 2min, put back, ecu is not reset as are all DTC errors.
yes , ecu is now fully ready to run car (it was before all above), and all new codes are REAL. it never lies, to you...!!!

first off, the charge system was dead, and the battery died, this is not unusual at all.
the engine and all electrics run off the alternator , not the battery.
the battery is to start and is back up power source, just like the Boing 787 battery failure.(headlines....) same deal.. (APU)

so it died, due to a discharged battery.
the real question , were the belts ignored, or do you have a seizing engine accessory.? see my belt page.
http://www.fixkick.com/belts.html

the reason we ask that (CEL) is to find out 2 things
code 51, bad EGR , sure drive 100,000 , ignored. (oldest story in world. bla bla..)

any other DTC, ? why in the world would you ignore any ecu telling you a major
part is bad. whY? at least look and be aware of its complaint?
until you look using a paper clip, (10min work) you dont know.


IF CAR MISFIRES AT IDLE: (we need to know hot, cold or both?)
1: it's too rich?, or needs a tune up. ever do the 60k tune up on your car? (or a new oxygen sensor at about 100k?)
2: if tuned up (doing the 60k service points) ? then check for spark tips, for black and or wet with fuel, showing too rich.
3: if idle is bad hot ? egr stuck open, RPM ever lower than 800? is the coolant reaching 180F and holding (dash gauge is near useless and for sure after 18 years)
ill stop until we get CEL data, and 1, and 2 covered

http://www.fixkick.com/IGN_timing/tune-ups.html

[centexn]

#4 Bex......Sorry for the delay....you are correct in your quick analysis. Hooked jumper from 2 to 4..CEL glowing while running but did not throw codes. Now, where is this switch. I saw a yt vid not long ago where a guy located a switch behind paneling @ knee level which according to him re-set CEL. Is this the SES you are referring to??

[centexn]

#5..XXX..

Let me add some detail to my original post. First I will own up to negligence in maintenance. No excuses. I am a terrible procrastinator. I bought the vehicle about six months knowing there were some issues which needed attention among which is dizzy o-ring, timing belt/wp, and an AC problem of some sort. Not knowing the maintenance history of this truck, I am aware I am living on borrowed time given the 60k timing belt change is overdue by that much mileage again.

Until recently, I had intermittent belt squeal upon start up. Sometimes it would, sometimees it wouldn''t. All accessories functioned perfectly with the exception of the AC which I already had been informed was an issue. So I just never used it.


Thanks for the correction re charging system component function. I didn't realize the role of the alternator in providing direct power to the accessories while underway. I always thought in addition to starting power the battery also provided power for accessories. The battery fail on this truck was due to bad alt vbelt without enough grip to spin the alternator fast enough to charge the battery.

Since there were no performance issues before the belt change except for the battery not charging, I would have expected the same after belt change.

I am now past the jump without codes thrown. So locating SES and moving on.

I have appreciated your work and your willingness to document some of the practical expertise you have gained over the years. My only wish is I could actually have the mechanics gene many of the people on this site are blessed with. I would be willing to be there is not a drop of oil or grease on your garage floor and your tool box has a place for every tool and every tool is in its place.

[Bex]

First, regarding the SES (a/k/a 'nag' switch). You will see a small panel under the steering column which you remove. Put your hand straight down, about 2-3 inches and feel along the side that is closest to you. You will feel a TINY nub - a sliding switch that can be moved from one side to the other. Slide the switch to the opposite side of where it is now. That will turn the nag off. Now, if your CEL remains on, once again try to get the codes - with the nag off, you will be able to get them. Code 12 means that the ECU sees no gross failures. Get whatever codes are there, (presumably you understand how they flash out?? if not, read here:
Check Engine Light )
write the codes down, and then remove the dome light fuse for a minute, so that the codes clear. Now drive and see if the CEL comes back on. These will now be real time codes.

[xxx]

in some countries, the lamp is labeled , service engine soon (ses) in others (laws) its
Check engine light=CEL (a tech calls it the MIL) nomatter...

this is an international forum, so i call the mileage lamp NAG that, to show its uselessness. (this silly feature was for leaded fuel, long gone and useless as expletives ,raised fist !)

and you call it anything, i dont care,.... some call it the ENGINE LAMP.

The nag in only FOUND (featured)
On:
USA cars (some Canadians buy USA cars and dont even know it is) market 03
never on CALIF cars. Market 33, nor on any other market car in the world.
1995 sidekick 1.6l 16v 112k jlx
95 , open hood look up, see vac map? see USA feder, regs there, in word,
if it states calif, it has the NAG, switch.
all this is stated on my CEL, SES<NAG and OD page.
Blinking-Lamp

The CEL lamp is shared with the NAG logic (mileage logic nag)
so if the NAG is active, the CEL function is DEAD (1 lamp shared, is dumb)
if the CEL dont go off driving , look at the hood sticker,
if still on , find the nag lamp or place the diagnostic jumper
if the lamp does not flash, the NAG is active or the ECU is BAD.


no 60k, ( the belts are checked at the 60k all belts and in fact all come off, so when put back on they are set to 22lbs so cant slip.)
so not doing the 60k , you waste fuel (bad spark) and risk a walk home with the Tbelt snapped.
i know vast people drive to the fail point, for some its an adventure. (others get mugged on the walk home)

Is the lamp out driving, ? the CEL? (SES, MIL, NAG whatever)

btw my unified page shows where a 95 NAG switch resides, posted 100s of times.
here.

[xxx]

suzuki hides the switch
so the you cant flip it, thus making the brown shirts , happy.
it does unplug for future freedom and does not work like an 1991.!
the 91 can be touched easy, (down below) 95 is a PITA.
not found on CALIF cars. ... ok?

the video is on my page too, but is not needed at all, just the 3 photos on my nag page, cover all 89-95 USA FED NAG cars.


http://www.fixkick.com/CEL/NAG-Lamp.html

ever cure the rough idle? (low battery) or do you have rough idle (misfire )still..