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Old 01-28-2013, 12:48 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Idle Issues

Hey all, first post here. My vehicle is a 1994 16valve 5 speed Suzuki Sidekick 4 door with 4wd ( I hope this is all the info I need to include.)

Last Friday my dumb ass left the headlights on and it drained the battery completely, well in my infinite wisdom I think I connected the jumper cables the wrong way because it blew the 60A yellow fuse under the hood, I assume that's the starter fuse. Anyway, yesterday I replace the fuse, jump the car, and get her home and she seems to be running fine until I go out to start her up to run to wally world, here is where the idling issues started.

It started strong and ran up to about 1500rpm for a few seconds before settling down to 800, almost immediately it dipped past that and started to bog down, I had to lightly feather the throttle for a few minutes but it seemed to level out after that and I was able to drive normally without having to keep it alive at stop signs.

Did the same thing again this morning, started and ran fine, got warmed up, but once I stopped for a short errand and went to restart the car I experienced the idle issues again, wouldn't hold at 800 at all, my interior lights/dome lights are gone for some reason also.

I'm planning on checking all the fuses tonight as well as cleaning this EGR valve i've been reading about. Might there be any other tips you guys have? I'm really hoping I didn't fry my ECU/electrical system by connecting the jumpers the wrong way.

TIA for the help.

Edit: I forgot to add, I have been driving the truck since March and it has had the CEL on the WHOLE TIME. It has driven great up until now so I assume the light is being thrown because of an 02 sensor or something emissions related. NOW when I start the car the CEL is not present, but will return after about 10 minutes of normal driving.

2nd Edit: Took it for a lunchtime drive, started up, idled fine, CEL appeared shortly after as usual, once I made it back to work I started the car over and over several times to try to replicate the idling issue and I couldn't seem to get it to happen again, it did dip down to about 600 but shortly after returned to the standard 800. Turn on the H/L, A/C, everything does bog the rpm down a bit, but when it's shut off it will return to 800 again.

Last edited by l3af; 01-28-2013 at 01:17 PM.
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:51 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Welcome to the forum! And whoops!! So, first question, is your check engine light on with the key in the on position, and then off once the car is running??
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Old 01-28-2013, 12:56 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Do you have or did you at one time observe a check engine light?

Hooking up a battery backwards can put an enormous strain on the electrical system. There could be a multitude of issues that can arise from it.
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Old 01-28-2013, 01:14 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bex View Post
Welcome to the forum! And whoops!! So, first question, is your check engine light on with the key in the on position, and then off once the car is running??
I have edited my post a bit but "normal" has been with the CEL illuminated.

As of lunchtime today, the CEL is on when the key is on, and off when the car is started, however after about 5 miles/car warmed up the CEL will return.
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Old 01-28-2013, 01:17 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by razor02097 View Post
Do you have or did you at one time observe a check engine light?

Hooking up a battery backwards can put an enormous strain on the electrical system. There could be a multitude of issues that can arise from it.
I have edited the OP to include the information that you've asked.
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Old 01-28-2013, 01:44 PM   #6 (permalink)
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The CEL should be on with the key in the on position - this is the ECU self check. In any event, you really shouldn't be driving around for years with this light on (unless it is the service engine soon function, that comes on at specific miles on the odometer). Don't assume that it's the o2, as normally this will throw a code when its really almost dead. You need to check for codes.
Check Engine Light
First see if you can get the code 12 just with the key on. Then, leave the diagnostic connector in place, and start the car up and drive. At some point (when the CEL would come on when you are driving) it will register the code that it sees in real time. Maybe have someone with you, to count the flashes!!
Frankly, if the car is bogging when you put that load on the engine, it is also possible that your idle speed control solenoid needs to be cleaned with carb cleaner (hopefully) or is slowly saying goodbye (expensive).
Check for your codes, and report what you get.
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:03 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bex View Post
The CEL should be on with the key in the on position - this is the ECU self check. In any event, you really shouldn't be driving around for years with this light on (unless it is the service engine soon function, that comes on at specific miles on the odometer). Don't assume that it's the o2, as normally this will throw a code when its really almost dead. You need to check for codes.
Check Engine Light
First see if you can get the code 12 just with the key on. Then, leave the diagnostic connector in place, and start the car up and drive. At some point (when the CEL would come on when you are driving) it will register the code that it sees in real time. Maybe have someone with you, to count the flashes!!
Frankly, if the car is bogging when you put that load on the engine, it is also possible that your idle speed control solenoid needs to be cleaned with carb cleaner (hopefully) or is slowly saying goodbye (expensive).
Check for your codes, and report what you get.
I will get codes and report ASAP. Thanks.
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Old 01-29-2013, 09:24 AM   #8 (permalink)
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x2 all the above, why not pull codes 1st. really. just a paper clip.
http://www.fixkick.com/CEL/CEL.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by l3af View Post
Hey all, first post here. My vehicle is a 1994 16valve 5 speed Suzuki Sidekick 4 door with 4wd ( I hope this is all the info I need to include.) yes. and usa too.


Last Friday my dumb ass left the headlights on and it drained the battery completely, well in my infinite wisdom I think I connected the jumper cables the wrong way because it blew the 60A yellow fuse under the hood, I assume that's the starter fuse. NO
the 60 blow when you short the Alternator to ground.
but reversing battery lugs, invites , causing the alternator, parts to latch up.
some alts have parts in side that conduct backwards, (Alt brands very by brand) your lucky the battery didnt explode near 1000 amps.

you need to respect batteries more,, IMO.
not only that, the ECU dont like reversals and most electronics, made.
some electronics have diode protector but NOT ALL.
on a new car the damage can hit $2000 easy, next time use the cables
with respect for the expensive parts..... Im not ragging on you, just trying to save you (acid bath?) and your wallet......


Anyway, yesterday I replace the fuse, jump the car, and get her home and she seems to be running fine until I go out to start her up to run to wally world, here is where the idling issues started.

It started strong and ran up to about 1500rpm for a few seconds before settling down to 800, almost immediately it dipped past that and started to bog down, (how low, in RPM see dash?)
(egr stuck open or an injector failed)?

I had to lightly feather the throttle for a few minutes but it seemed to level out after that and I was able to drive normally without having to keep it alive at stop signs. (clean the EGR main. it must not stick ever.)



Did the same thing again this morning, started and ran fine, got warmed up, but once I stopped for a short errand and went to restart the car I experienced the idle issues again, wouldn't hold at 800 at all, my interior lights/dome lights are gone for some reason also.
what lights, state them.. dash lamps? dash idiot lamps.,CEL dead. what lamps.?
is your battery not charging, did you blow up the Alternator.
if the battery voltage is not 14.7vdc running the Alternator is dead.
is the dash charge lamp on?
got a volt meter ?


I'm planning on checking all the fuses tonight as well as cleaning this EGR valve i've been reading about. Might there be any other tips you guys have? I'm really hoping I didn't fry my ECU/electrical system by connecting the jumpers the wrong way. ( only pure luck saves you>.. its a bad thing)

TIA for the help.

Edit: I forgot to add, I have been driving the truck since March and it has had the CEL on the WHOLE TIME.
a paper clip away from flash codes, click CEL in my diagnostic page.

It has driven great up until now so I assume the light is being thrown because of an 02 sensor or something emissions related. NOW when I start the car the CEL is not present, but will return after about 10 minutes of normal driving. sure the code 51, EGR, whats new. not looking is new.


2nd Edit: Took it for a lunchtime drive, started up, idled fine, CEL appeared shortly after as usual, once I made it back to work I started the car over and over several times to try to replicate the idling issue and I couldn't seem to get it to happen again, it did dip down to about 600 but shortly after returned to the standard 800. Turn on the H/L, A/C, everything does bog the rpm down a bit, but when it's shut off it will return to 800 again.
you have 2 problems, no idle regulation.
and a bad EGR i bet you on EGR. reg is bad. for sure.
and both make each other worse.
this ECU drops , to limphome cutting out idle regulation, so not having
a scan tool to see that or not getting the flash codes. makes it hard
to discover,. limphome.

The ecu does that, it sees a bad sensor, simulates it to keep motor going
but drops all idle, and runs rich , wasting tons of fuel.
that is what limphome is, to just limp home, pull the codes.

one way to tell a bad eGR (sticking)
is it happens just before common to a stop?
and
feathering throttle takes more effort than just a low idle.
case in points.
i turn on HL/AC and defrost and fan, rpm drops and my foot can easily correct idle back to 800. hot.
but if EGR sticks, it takes a more agressive foot action, do to Exhaust wrecking
idle combustion, so bad..... you must add more air.

see?

and
if parked and rpm drops, and hood is open, press the EGR main diaphram and it goes, plunk. oops was stuck and idle corrects.
dont get burned. back there.... use great care doing this on a hot EGR.

what do i do.,
well
i clean the EGR perfect then defeat it, to see if that solves my idle problem. its not hard, (do not snap off the 6mm screws, they are tiny, ask how ....????)
if the idle is bad now.
then its a too lean motor (gross induction air leaks.), making idle impossible to control
or ISC failure. (it can be cleaned, ) your IAC is good. the isC is a slave of the ECU, after all the ECU controls idle , hot and never in limphome.
http://www.fixkick.com/IDLE-AIR/idle-index-home.html

Last edited by xxx; 01-29-2013 at 09:33 AM.
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