Good day guys - First post here, don't know where else to turn.
About two days ago while driving (can't remember if it occurred soon after a crank up or while driving - I can say it happened suddenly) there was a slight loss of power but moreover the engine sounded worse than a slowed down lawn mower.
At this point I've checked the ignition system and appear to be getting a good spark on that dead cylinder. But it just isn't igniting. I've also swapped around the corresponding cables just in case.
The only thing I can think of at this point would be a fuel system issue. The fuel where I'm at is incredibly horrible so I'm leaning towards a clogged injector.
By hearing I can tell the injector is firing although weak compared to the others.
I've yet to check the compression, but to find a compression tester in my neck of the woods will be a mission, However the vehicle has less than 50k Mileage so this to be honest is the last thing on my mind.
Another thing - there appear to be four odd designed "bolts" holding the throttle assembly onto the intake manifold. They are threaded all the way through with a movable nut. Perhaps a special tool or technique.
Any insight would be much appreciated. Such a work horse this jeep.
Only 50K? Are you sure? That is extremely low mileage for a 20 year old vehicle. The odometer rolls over to 0 every 100K miles, so maybe 150K?
If you are in the US, then all 92 4 door trackicks had 1.6 16V MPFI engines (one injector per cylinder). My guess would be a plugged/restricted injector.
It could be a spark plug issue. But it sounds like you were getting good spark from that plug, when tested. You could swap that plug with another plug and see if the problem stays with the plug, or with the cylinder.
It could also be an ECM problem. All 92/93 4 door trackicks that I have owned have had an ECM issue at some point. The ECMs can usually be fixed by replacing the capacitors and checking/fixing any damaged copper traces on the circuit board. Generally when it is an ECM problem the engine won't run at all, or it affects all cylinders/injectors/plugs...but anything is possible.
Could also be a burnt valve on that cylinder. A compression check would help diagnose that.
Checking/setting the valve lash would also be a good idea, if it has never been done, or has been awhile since it was done.
This model (Sidekick 4x4) 4 Door. 4 Cylinder (Im guessing MPI 16v G16B some tranny unknown 3/4/5 speeds (yes, counts many times.)
NOT ONLY THAT #3 injector can not ever click on any TBI , in N.America. kicks. it dont have one, so my virtual sig is good.
no location stated, making all posts near useless... what location or better the car vin or market code, in canada they 4 markets ! USA fed, USA Calif, Canada and gray market. so what it? not reading sticYk2 caused this breach. you ask for help with zero inputsS ON CAR YOU HAVE OR LOCATION.. fail.
then post funny bolts with out a photo or exact locations....
mileage don't matter, what matters is reality. after 20 year the motor may have been changes 3 times, PO hates AF?)
1: good motor , what is your compression WOT ?
2: good spark , tune it and and do the 60k. and check timing and advance.
3: good fueling
those are the steps. 1,2,3,
going backwards is costly for parts, time and palm hits fore head , over and over.... keep an open mind on failures.... fate rules.
could be lots of things, why guess.?
pick a path, guess, or tests.?
you can see my sig click that, then put compression in the search box. and find. http://www.fixkick.com/compressiontest.html
bingo, all steps + vacuum and leak down all on 1 page. (and the safe way)
thus proving motor is good. (rare exceptions, but all are fun)
then good EGR (first really ,it only needs to be closed and defeated to make diagnostic progress. , later hook it back up)
So, not just spark is good, you need to check the timing. with a $15 HF strobe light.
if timing is good, great, if bad the Tbelt slipped. (ever do a 60k mile tuneup with the belt? if not, why not?)
ok timing and motor is good, now what
well
FUELING. (you made it to step 3)
I will pretend listed 1 and 2 are good above. motor good, and spark good and timed.....
this post is unique.
how to DIY fix a car, no mech, no tools nor parts store or stores with tools. to buy or rent. now that is a tall order.! but thanks for saying, and so we can see the truth
and context of your issues. few do. here.
Bad fueling,... i guess.....
and #3 is suspect , (lots of things can be bad to run badly but lets work just #3)
Quote:
#3 dont click (inj) or sounds funny.
1: pull spark plug, is it ugly?, white ,dry, wet with fuel, or what? that tip. clue1?
2: compression on #3 ,20 psi, 90, or 170+ PSI (clue 2)
3: injector coil ohms, at 10,, good.
4: i do the Pump page leak down test. and it passes. (not leaking at rail during the key on 40 PSI leak down test on my pump page.) search "pump"
5: i do the power balance test in #3 and it fails. (no drop)
the injector is clogged or sticking , mid stroke. (move injector #3 to #1) now #1 cylinder is dead, or flooding....
here is my injector page s, shows every why in the world to work an injector
Cheers !
PS
odd bolts? (I worry when i hear this)
odd designed "bolts" ???????????
on TB? why are you worried about the TB? and its bolts and they are not ODD.
unless hacked, no photos, no guesses....
16v a real 16v in the N.American continent others are different world wide.
there are no odd bolts show me.?.. unless ISO metric hex is odd...?
the one odd bolt (machine screw) is the throttle stop and is to keep crazy POs from messing with it, the one screw on car not to touch. (isc screw mostly)
** Just to provide an update, and thanks for the previous detail post by the way.
Been a stressful two weeks trying to sort this out.
#3 Cylinder still not firing, well it fired for a few minutes today while idling but once in gear, it exhibits the same issues (severe loss of power - stuttering).
Changed the Fuel injector (brand new). Swapped around plug wires, new plug, checked vacuum lines and changed dist. cap.
Ran a compression test although it did appear marginally lower than others, nonetheless the cylinder does "hold" compression.
Lord willing - tomorrow, I'll remove the valve cover to see if there are any mechanical issues. I'm leaning towards a stuck valve of some sort.
Any input would be highly appreciated. Is there anything in particular I should look for once the cover is removed?
To answer the previous points. Yes it does have <50k mileage which is why I'm hoping it not a severe mechanical issue although things happen.
It is indeed a Four Cylinder 16valve efi engine with four independent fuel injectors.
As far as timing is concerned, how often does one encounter a slipped' belt? Or rather how often does a "timed system" become undone under normal circumstances?
(will post photos along with a video tomorrow - hopefully that will help)
You should post your compression numbers, confirming that you did the test with your gas pedal to the floor. If you look at the link under 'xxx' posts, you will see the link to his pages, which will give you info on the specs for the valve lash adjustment - you may find that your valves for cylinder #3 are way out of spec, causing your problem. Slipped timing belt is not terribly common, but of course, can happen. The compression test would indicate this, to some extent. On your car, values for compression should be 170psi very minimum, but much closer to 190 on all cylinders.
** Just to provide an update, and thanks for the previous detail post by the way.
Been a stressful two weeks trying to sort this out.
#3 Cylinder still not firing, well it fired for a few minutes today while idling but once in gear, it exhibits the same issues (severe loss of power - stuttering).
Changed the Fuel injector (brand new). Swapped around plug wires, new plug, checked vacuum lines and changed dist. cap.
Ran a compression test although it did appear marginally lower than others, nonetheless the cylinder does "hold" compression.
only numbers count
1,2,34
1 90
2 91
3 75
4 85
see_ , IT HAS nothing to do with #3 ITS Timing belt slip. or cog shear.
Lord willing - tomorrow, I'll remove the valve cover to see if there are any mechanical issues. I'm leaning towards a stuck valve of some sort.
Any input would be highly appreciated. Is there anything in particular I should look for once the cover is removed?
To answer the previous points. Yes it does have <50k mileage which is why I'm hoping it not a severe mechanical issue although things happen.
It is indeed a Four Cylinder 16valve efi engine with four independent fuel injectors.
As far as timing is concerned, how often does one encounter a slipped' belt? Or rather how often does a "timed system" become undone under normal circumstances?
(will post photos along with a video tomorrow - hopefully that will help)
Regards
post your numbers, please
if 1 is low, post that, and use oil , all at wot
only 1 teaspoon of oil if low. or you risk hydralocking.
not doing the 60k service , invites, huge wastes of time.
the 60k in in the op guide,. ever read that¿
it includes , tbelt and lash setting.
workihng engine symtoms from lack of 60k service, tail twister....
one post long ago i laugh constantly ever time i think of that post.
Quote:
my grand dad said 90s ok, my model T ford did that and it runs great.
this is not your fathers Oldsmobile..... sorry..
with last set, the compression test is one of the best ways to see , just how much life is in that motor. add a touch oil and a leak down guage and boy can you see more. (see the tricks on that page=)
search compression on my page, its there.
#3 Cylinder still not firing, well it fired for a few minutes today while idling but once in gear, it exhibits the same issues (severe loss of power - stuttering).
Changed the Fuel injector (brand new). Swapped around plug wires, new plug, checked vacuum lines and changed dist. cap.
Ran a compression test although it did appear marginally lower than others, nonetheless the cylinder does "hold" compression.
Lord willing - tomorrow, I'll remove the valve cover to see if there are any mechanical issues. I'm leaning towards a stuck valve of some sort.
Any input would be highly appreciated. Is there anything in particular I should look for once the cover is removed?
As far as timing is concerned, how often does one encounter a slipped' belt? Or rather how often does a "timed system" become undone under normal circumstances?
(will post photos along with a video tomorrow - hopefully that will help)
Regards
If only #3 wasn't getting spark/fuel, then it isn't a timing belt "slippage" issue (which timing belts rarely slip, IMO).
With a true ~50K miles, your compression numbers should be at least 2x what you posted. Either you didn't do the compression test correctly, or the compression tester gauge is not reading correctly, or your valves are not adjusted correctly.
It could also be an ECM problem. Like I said earlier, 92 16Vs are notorious for bad ECMs...although when the ECM goes bad it usually affects all cylinders/injectors, not just an individual one.
I don't know if I would agree that 92 16v's are notorious for bad ECU's, any more than any other older Trackick with Rubycon caps. However, as you say, all cylinders would be affected with a bad ECU, not just one. Compression numbers need to be posted here.
ecu fails not on one cyl,huh?
cept when the single driver is open ,shorted or weak.
cept when the i/o port on said driver is bad.
4 ways that is...
not counting a cracked traces, to any of those parts. above... 5 more?
9 or more ways easy, (i spent 15years of my life doing this...(a prev. life)
i dont understand all this guessing.?
the noid did what?
the compression did what.?
the lash is at what?
off the VC lid and look at lash, look at the lobes, are they all good, not flat?
all the above is like 1hour labor.
the belts die at 60k to 100k max.; that is their DESIGN life. 60k is spec change out.
what the magic there ? no belt last life of motor !
the ECU can fail in 1000s of ways, ill not list them.
he led off with #3 misfiring.
bad compression( on it) or cam lobe, not lifting it proper.
bad spark (1st)
bad fueling.
i do spark first then compression(it's 15m job) then do all the 5 injector tests
on my injector page.. last. after all,it is longer set of procedures.
pressure
leak down rate
the balance test.
power to injector x3
noid test
injector ohms. x4 or the dead one.
etc
only the op can decide what test and in what order
all i can do is point to each test,and answer questions about it
so far we are at , post the compression numbers, WOT.
if low, try the oil trick.
if all are 90 the belt slipped.
I don't know if I would agree that 92 16v's are notorious for bad ECU's, any more than any other older Trackick with Rubycon caps. However, as you say, all cylinders would be affected with a bad ECU, not just one. Compression numbers need to be posted here.
I wasn't meaning to imply that the "other" older ECMs aren't notorious for going bad either. But compared to say 94/95 16V ECMs the 92/93 16V ECMs are much more likely to go bad. I have never had a bad 94/95 ECM, but nearly, if not every, 92/93 16V ECM I have had has went bad at some point.
on this forum and others.
all 89-95 , die from caps, just 1 time.
if marked Rubicon. every damn one !
if not rubi then never do they fail.. Nichicon dont fail. try some..
not one logged 96+ ever , failed for main filter caps.
since 95 and 96 are one year apart, that fact speaks volumes.
may are already changed long before you got the car.
or it would not be running. in most cases.... I do have near new ecu
(boxed for 20 years) that has rubi's and is not bad.
heat + time= rubi = fail fast.
injector drivers do fail. and rare and random.
totally.
seen fails here since 2008 (HERE this forum)
vast numbers, but most post for this are wits end, so,,,,,,,
its just one brand that fails.
and it leaks or explodes,etc.
no other brand cap have i seen or heard of went bad in this ECU.
89-95 is the only year range and depends on prior servicing....
if no rubicons, then move on , find the real reason for the failure if any.
we can work each one,
if you have a scope we can work faster.
the noid lamp used correctly can be 99% effectly . the 8v is the harder one. to test.
2 drivers , 4 fail modes.
open,shorted,weak,or leaking when off.
lets to tests,correctly and follow facts.
no guessing need be done
not ever.
it's your cash, but why waste it.?
ask questions.be specific. and do show all data in test.
not,just its ok.
this world is truly analog, despite the digital front ends.
post the compression data,wot. all of it, please.
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