High Idle & Trans issues....

[scoobymlr]

Hello to ALL, first off I bought this Tracker in Feb 14 1997 new.. Its a 96 geo Tracker 2dr 3spd auto 4x4 1.6l 16v.

History: a family member was using it for a few years and ran it into the ground Then they let their A hole bf work on it. I took it back after they let it sit for 5 years...

When I got it back it needed all new; rotors, pads, drums, shoes, cat, plugs (gaped), wires, cap & rotor, radiator, T-stat (195F), timing belt, water pump, tensioner, IAC, O2 sensor frt & rear, pcv, ALL fluids changed, trans filter & drain plug gasket, timimg belt cover, crank seal, tires, mafs, air hoses, battery,oil pressure sensor, temp sensor. plenum gasket, tb gasket, head gasket. valve lash adjusted, ECT....

CEL CODES:
P0740 TCC
RPM @ 3500 55mph. No lock up. I have changed trans fluid 3x's, bench test solenoid & some times it click not all. ordered new tcc solenoid (PS I found out that my cluster broke & was replaced with a cluster from a 4dr 5spd. Does that matter?

P0505
Idles at 1900 cold then drops to 1400 warm. prior to cleaning the plenum & replacing gaskets MAFS, PVC, it idled at 850. I used all new gaskets. cant find any are leaks.

I have been going over this Tracker for 4 months and have not had to post till now. I am so It should have never needed all this work if they would have just not touched it....I also have read thru all KICK-FIX site
No luck with these 2 codes any help please

[Bex]

Did you follow the Kickfix info on timing the engine when you did the timing belt?? And re-timed the ignition afterward?
Have you replaced the TCC solenoid yet, and if so, did this correct your lock-up problem?

[xxx]

is coolant temps at 180F or more and never ever dropping. once hot?
if it varies, the rubber ring is missing on the thermostat.
mandatory it is.

Originally Posted by scoobymlr

Hello to ALL, first off I bought this Tracker in Feb 14 1997 new.. Its a 96 geo Tracker 2dr 3spd auto 4x4 1.6l 16v.

History: a family member was using it for a few years and ran it into the ground Then they let their A hole bf work on it. I took it back after they let it sit for 5 years...
long time sitting , this makes for bad fuel and fuel system contamination. all bad and hard work that.


When I got it back it needed all new; rotors, pads, drums, shoes, cat, plugs (gaped), wires, cap & rotor, radiator, T-stat (195F), timing belt, water pump, tensioner, IAC, O2 sensor frt & rear, pcv, ALL fluids changed, trans filter & drain plug gasket, timimg belt cover, crank seal, tires, mafs, air hoses, battery,oil pressure sensor, temp sensor. plenum gasket, tb gasket, head gasket. valve lash adjusted, ECT....
sounds like my 3 pos dogs, same list. but maf.


CEL CODES:
P0740 TCC (ecu dont see the RPM drop with lockup so throws this)

RPM @ 3500 55mph. No lock up. I have changed trans fluid 3x's, bench test solenoid(the relay or the inside tranny solenoid?

& some times it click not all. ordered new tcc solenoid (PS I found out that my cluster broke & was replaced with a cluster from a 4dr 5spd. Does that matter? (should be ok.only the VSS counts there..)

P0505
Idles at 1900 cold then drops to 1400 warm. prior to cleaning the plenum & replacing gaskets MAF , PVC, it idled at 850. I used all new gaskets. cant find any are leaks.
we can find it ask... i have a bad idle page , check that out.

I have been going over this Tracker for 4 months and have not had to post till now. I am so It should have never needed all this work if they would have just not touched it....I also have read thru all KICK-FIX site
No luck with these 2 codes any help please

just 2 codes. easy , but doe it drive ok you forgot that....part...
no p0300s?
and the scan tool shows closed loop, active at idle and cruising?

do not attmenptt to fix 400 until all else, is working
the 96+ uses the EGR map to check vacuum and working, EGR.

really its 2 base failures. TCC,
see my tcc page.
TCC failure

the acid test for 740 , its not hard.
using a test lamp or voltmeter
see test point 1...
attach the meter or lamp to C104 or 301
ill use 301 nomenclature.
does pin 2 and 4 go to 12v , when the ECU demands it>
the graphic is there on that page showing the speed points.
see photo below for this. speed, about 50mph. (lock and unlock)
next (i skip 400s that is last way last, )
bad idle.
block all source of air, and the leak is there.
the 16v will mess up from the intake valves all the way to the MAP
there can be no illegal leaks or the air-meter lies. and so does mixture.
have you pinched all the vacuum lines
and then pinched the top air iSC line? (just drop to 400 rpm or there is huge leak)
I have trick to block the IAC. see photo 2 with the duct tape trick.
remove pipe, put on tape put back pipe or MAF will be dead.


http://kickfix.ac-vw.com/tranny/auto...C/3L30LOCK.jpg


IAC block trick ,see that slot marked,IAC input port.
this can be blocked ,(do it hot motor) and this proves the IAC
good or bad, it must be closed hot, if motor races. fast. hot.

duct tape or i use putty, non hardening putty, the tape may fly off ,it not pristine cleaned.
Throttle body air supplies - Image 17 of 37


more..
compression good?
is vacuum steady at idle near 19inches. HG?
is the #4 exhaust down tube not cracked?, like most are.? makes 02 sensor lie if crack sucks air.
if car runs in closed loop at idle , and cruise its probably ok that exh tube.
is the air tube on the top of engine not cracked, every inch perfect? from TB air horn to MAF? there must not be leaks here. and is common.

when cruising , is the LTFT , looking ok. not railed, or way offset. from normal?

if you have air leaks the LTFT goes way rich. look for that clue. the O2 finds the leak error and attempts to correct it with fuel trim. so trim values are very good evidence.
your front 02 is new, rear is not needed (#2 is for a cat monitor). but the front sets fuel trim. and since new and no exhaust leaks, you can trust it to tell you how the trim is....
A good engine runs (no leaks of air) runs a tad rich the 02 finds this and sets negative fuel trim, 5 to 10%?
if the engine is running naturally lean, (leaks) the LTFT then goes way rich, adding fuel. a large number 0 % is not adding or subtracting fuel.
if you have a full scan tool you can see this.
mine runs -3% LTFT at idle. the polar sign is key.


bad idle speeds.
keep in mind how the 1996 system works.
on a hot motor
illegals leaks ,be them below or in front of the Throttle body, will case a lean condition (un metered air, the MAF never saw it) this can make RPM drop, do to lean bogging effects (o2 not able to correct it)
shows up as LTFT adding lots of extra fuel
legal leaks are fully metered air. and (no LTFT offsets and look normal) but RPM rise to illegal levels and the idle speed air screw can get you to the 800 RPM (top rear of TB is that screw)
3 examples of a legal air leak are (stuck open ISC< or stuck open IAC) or some BF(from H3LL) , fiddling the throttle stop screw, put it back to .200 inch and leave it there for ever..
a 4th example, is BF unscrewed he bleed screw and put back the black cap and you dont know its there....

[Bex]

Just for clarity, for purposes of this forum, the IAC is the mechanical air valve on the passenger side of the throttle body. It is mechanical, based on a wax pellet that opens and closes the valve. The ISC is the electronic solenoid. Presumably it is the ISC that you replaced?? I don't think that the IAC malfunctioning will throw an ISC code, although perhaps an air leak on the mechanism will prevent the ISC (electronic solenoid) from being able to regulate the idle circuit.
Have you checked your MAF wiring - blue/black wire is battery voltage, black ground wire is .5v, the gray/black wire (output wire) should rise in voltage as you are revving the car, starting at about 1.7v when car is idling at 800 rpm (which your's doesn't do, so expect a higher reading).
Regarding the actual ISC solenoid, have you pinched the air hose that runs to it from the air pipe, to see if the idle drops? (it should). There is a plunger inside the ISC that can get stuck - this can be cleaned with carb cleaner, and then tested to see if the plunger vibrates properly. If you remove the ISC and shake it, you should not hear it rattle.
But I would also confirm that all timing has been done properly, as well.

[xxx]

clarity depends on what books you have,, unstated,. so..
the names don't matter. the SUZ and SAE changed them 3 times, so no matter.
what matters is that the both work.
and the thermal one has no wires, that does tell you all you need to know there.
(besides experience in how they fail, lots.)
505s. IAC malfunction
this means that the ECU can not control idle, IAC (meaning I lost idle air control) in this case, means for any case
any leaks. any reason, (even gross lean,,,,) (50 ways list on my bad idle page)
it just tells him what he already knows, in that idle does not have control.
yes, which IAC/ISC did you replace, my guess the ISC (electric) as buying and iAC (thermal) is problematic... < speculation.

his scan tools will show a bad maf ( 2 ways)
by low grams /second and for sure long term fuel trim goes nuts, loss of closed loop, and the trim goes way to the PLUS side, say +20% trim.
there are only 2 idle controls
one closes and does nothing hot, that be the wax thermal unit below the throttle body. my parts finder shows where it is and how to test both.
the electric controls, (even a newer name today) is ECU idle speed control device.
it controls idle under all conditions. including alternator over load, and when you
shift in to drive, it opens way up.

but all this is speculation because he has not posted drive-ablilty hot and cold.

The IAC (thermal) if it sticks fully open (want one can send it) the ISC loses
command authority over idle, and rails and the engine screams hot and cold.
and may throw 505s.

(id suspect all timing is good since he replaced so many parts) including the Timing belt....)

not having a scan tool on any car over 1995 year, makes the job , long and hard.

[scoobymlr]

XXX ok
The car runs great driving down the road full power smoth. When i shift into D the rpms drop from 1400 to 900? Timing was done a per kik-fix site. Compersion is 1-189 2-187 3-189 4-185.
Bex yes i replaced the ISC. will be replacing the TCC solenoid this week. I did it about 6yrs ago.

PS XXX I cant get to you page or your links? is your site down?

yes I have pinched all vac lines the ISC when pinched drops idle from 1400 to 1200. cant find any vac leaks. it seems like it might be a sensor.

I just wonder if the MAF that i have is not the right one for my year? I replaced it because I was getting the MAF code and mine was dead.

I have also cleaned the EGR and all the hoses and ports. no issues there

POOR gas mpg's around 19mpg

#4 ,3 & 1 on exhaust manifold were cracked. Fixed that and put on new gastkets & cat plus both o2 new Bosch

i did notice before changing the PCV that it was stuck open & the hose to it was filled with oil. So i took off the plenum and cleaned everything. Put it all back with new gaskets and PCV.

That is when the high Idle started??? the minute i started the car after all that???

[xxx]

Originally Posted by scoobymlr

XXX ok
The car runs great driving down the road full power smoth. When i shift into D the rpms drop from 1400 to 900? Timing was done a per kik-fix site. Compersion is 1-189 2-187 3-189 4-185.
Bex yes i replaced the ISC. ( i bet it was good.
GOOD MOOTER great so glad #1 is off the list.)
)
i can only assume the timing is set on the dizzy with the freeze jumper.

TCC:
will be replacing the TCC solenoid this week. I did it about 6yrs ago.
not doing the 2 tests invites failure,
bad relay
bad low pressure switch (tsb shows bypassing it, ,did you?)
read the TSB on your car there is a whole cry'g towel section on TCC !
revision. and delay modules added (anti hunt issues) bla bla bla
and for sure dont know what is on your car, considering those....
if you get power to the TEST PIN I showed.
the TCC splendid is bad or the TCC lock it self is bad.
there are 4 parts, most think its 2. its not.



PS XXX I cant get to your page or your links? is your site down? sorry YES>
yes, the solar powered server died, (2nd time in 10 years)
your lucky.. (not mine a major , in calif.) its back... sorry.

yes ,I have pinched all vac lines the ISC when pinched drops idle from 1400 to 1200. (FAIL) cant find any vac leaks. it seems like it might be a sensor. (NO IT IS NOT)
you need to test more.

if you pinch the ISC, air hose, what does that do? , it ends all ISC air.
no ifs buts or maybe;s ends it. its out of the path for air.
(blocking it take pulling hose and blocking the hose and nipple.
that is how you work a MAF system , never add leaks doing tests.
that leaves 2 more.
you turn down the bleed to closed (find it ye?t, i keep hinting )

but that is the hot idle bleed, you close it, and get say 1200. fail.
the bleed is now closed. 100% ,next.
so now that leaves 1 more leak'er, the IAC. (below T
you pack that with clay, still fast? is it ? you keep skipping the bleed and IAC, why is that? i will post the drawing again.

that leaves bad gaskets in the intake manifold
or some 'boyfriendor " screwed the idle stop. never do that.
but is set to .020 " that gap; this closes the main throttle 99.9999%
or about .001" open (its closed. the gap is so it cant JAM)
keep closing the ports and find the link
the engine can not run at all with no air. see?
yours has too much air, work that and fix the problem , I promise !
again i will list them.
1: bleed turned full CW, why not?
2: isc pin, fails. that means its good but there is a huge leak.
leave it pinched, (not this is a progress leak stopping saga.....
3: now set the butterly to .200" such that the throttle is fully closed
99.9% ( i have a nice photo showing my calipers doing that step.
it must be fully closed, some report its so close water can not pass
thru the bore. it true.
when running there are only 3 air sources, ISC,IAC and bleed.
block them and see the truth of this.
now step 4, block the IAC.
i showed how to do that with a nice photo. with clay.
now you have zero air. the car can not start , with no right foot help. see why?
no air. it just floods not, add 10% foot air , it it needs it.
if it starts now, and is running 1200 rpm there is a huge induction breach below the butterfly plate for sure, no ifs ands or buts....

do you see this logic, (blocking all natural air sources then find the leak.?

even with a smoke machine we have to do this in reverse.
blocking the natural to see, yes, the unnatural. (leaks)
vast youtube examples exist with that smoker tests..

I just wonder if the MAF that i have is not the right one for my year? I replaced it because I was getting the MAF code and mine was dead.
they are all the same 58B00 stamped on the side !in the usa, and rarely fail and cost $1000
tell me you didnt spend 1000 bucks on a new maf. ouch.
its so easy to test too, i have a whole page showing 3 ways to test this part. ok dead is dead, sorry for that loss, that sucks big time...

I have also cleaned the EGR and all the hoses and ports. no issues there (if its closes, its good, move on or defeat it for testing) easy.

POOR gas mpg's around 19mpg (ok that is good input. we will fix that , for sure. !!!)

#4 ,3 & 1 on exhaust manifold were cracked. Fixed that and put on new gaskets & cat plus both o2 new Bosch
but is it running in closed loop at idle and cruise, is think not.

DO YOU HAVE A SCAN TOOL FULL TOOL ,not some useless code reader.?
A full OBD2 scan


i did notice before changing the PCV that it was stuck open & the hose to it was filled with oil. So i took off the plenum and cleaned everything. Put it all back with new gaskets and PCV.

That is when the high Idle started??? the minute i started the car after all that???

coincidence? or a cracked hose.? (my bet , just bad luck)
the PCV, so that is easy , the pcv uses, metered air.
in an odd way on 16v. the intake sucks fumes from the valve cover
that is normal, but the valve cover gets fresh are not from the Air cleaner no, it uses , metered air if this hose is cracked, called PCV vent
it sucks un-metered air and causes lean. that crack , on MPI cars.
STuff happens....?????
if you have a second fault and motor is too rich (say high fuel pressure)
and the new leak forces lean, the idle can go high. (as AFR gets better, from too rich)
2 errors. (2 wrongs arenot a right)
there can be no leaks on the 16v hose and pipe system ,.
takes a physical inspection

more links, the server is up !
pack the IAC air horn slot on the right with clay and put it all back , sealed up
no mounts bolts just seal clamps end to end, with no leaks. (no broken mounts that suck air either on the main air tube.


IDLE stop H3LL:
some joker mess this up, set it to factory spec and leave it the for eternity , do that.
http://kickfix.ac-vw.com/fresh-air/S.../image_18.html

see the yellow PCV, see the yellow arrow below P? that hose must not BE CRACKED or the motor goes lean, can be horrible lean. (
http://kickfix.ac-vw.com/fresh-air/S.../image_19.html

this must never leak HOT. all this an more is in the slide show.
IAC
http://kickfix.ac-vw.com/fresh-air/S.../image_20.html



have you found the BLEED yet. its here. MR, bleed, he sets HOT IDLE> to 800.
http://kickfix.ac-vw.com/fresh-air/S.../image_22.html

here is the joker screw, that no man must ever touch ,at a diffr. angle.
http://kickfix.ac-vw.com/fresh-air/S.../image_24.html


if you have air leaks that are big the ECU can not correct that. it can only close the ISC for a 400 rpm drop if it cant drop the rpm then it cant.
its out of authority we call that (like trying to turn off a leaky faucet with harder turns, and fails. see?
do not blame the ISC until all leaks are found, do not. you did but now its new, and 2x dont blame it.

and the sensors, tell me the 1 sensor that can add air , after closing the 3 normal paths. ZERO ! there is no such animal. sorry.
do the sequential port blockages and behold the offender is know known.
i have a box of rubber corks that i use, plugging each of the 3 paths. and clay.

now slide 27 as promised.
see the 3 paths there. 4 if the fly plate was monkey fracked. put #4 right now. and work 1,2,3 (bleed, ISC and iAC)
block them in sequence. if it still races?,the injector cushions or intake gaskets leak. PCV vent hose (vc to maf pipe) bad. and cracked. brake booster leaking , no its blocked, EGR gasket leaking. Side winder SST gaskets missing , every thing attached to the vacuum plenum is suspect after the big 3 above are blocked and it still races.

http://kickfix.ac-vw.com/fresh-air/S.../image_27.html

[scoobymlr]

Ok XXX I have turned the bleed screw all the way cw, plug the IAC at tb, blocked off ISC. RPMS about 1200? (could TPS cause this?)

As for TCC my year doesnt have a pressure switch all I have is the tcc solenoid with 2 wires on it 1 grd 1 pwr. the power wire plugs into white wire coming out of trans.

In the morning I am going to go over everything you listed again

I need to get this to pass inspection its over due..LOL...

Thank you for all your help

[xxx]

Originally Posted by scoobymlr

Ok XXX I have turned the bleed screw all the way cw, plug the IAC at tb, blocked off ISC. RPMS about 1200? (could TPS cause this?)
NO ! not ever.
why, because all air sources are blocked, the engine must stall.
we just blacked all air.
if some nimrod , installed a TPS wrong jamming the fly plate open than sure, but i asked you to check that the fly plate is 100% closed
and there are 2 ways to mess that up.
the goofy PO fiddled the the stop screw and not the fly plate is open for ever, just look at it. the valve must be closed 100% (99.99)
if not, the stop was messed with or some one failed at indexing the
TPS, causing the back side of the TPS slider to jam up the index
bar for the TPS, blocking open the throttle for ever.
if those 2 common faults dont exist then the manifold is breached.
for sure.

its NOT a sensor. again, there is no air now.
so tell me. what sensor can add air, the answer is none.
baring the sillyness above. TPS mismouting or idle stop bunged.





As for TCC my year doesnt have a pressure switch all I have is the tcc solenoid with 2 wires on it 1 grd 1 pwr. the power wire plugs into white wire coming out of trans.

In the morning I am going to go over everything you listed again

I need to get this to pass inspection its over due..LOL...
so sorry that !

Thank you for all your help

you have a really bad and goofy air leak, that is good, it makes it easier for me, hard fails are all easy.
intermittent, take magic.

look at the TB, look down the bore. with a flash light.
can you slide a .001 feeler at the interference points, top of bottom?
if yes, it's jammed open, it must not be so.
The valve is fully closed, but is open just enough to stop the brass
fly from destroying the bore and jamming it forever (no wear happens)
That is why its a factory setting so that jam up and wear dont happen.
nothing more.. its just closed.

[scoobymlr]

Thanks XXX I got the idle down its at 850-900. Someone did touch the DO NOT touch screw. I put it back to spec like you said.

So now I just have to fix the TCC issue. not lock up at all. the new tcc solenoid comes in tomorrow. The reason for replacing it is that it doesnt always click & the o-rings that are inside are broken off floating around inside the tcc solenoid.

Ill keep you posted Thank you again