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Old 05-24-2011, 07:06 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default surging problem

1998 Tracker 4X4 1.6 16 valve automatic 2 door. After the car sets all night and I start it up in the morning, If I start moving slow it will surge two or three times. If I give it extra gas to increse speed it will not do it. When it does it I am going around 5 to 8 MPH.
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Old 05-24-2011, 07:53 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I have the same year and set up as you, I don't get any dramatic surging. However whether it is cold or hot and you use a lite steady foot on the gas you will feel it lightly surging up and down and will continue to do so with the same peddle pressure. Otherwise it runs fine and idles great, I know this does not answer anything for you but I thought I would pass it along.
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Old 05-24-2011, 08:15 PM   #3 (permalink)
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You explaned my problem better than I did. Same problem to the T.
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Old 05-25-2011, 08:41 AM   #4 (permalink)
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OK, is your check engine light on with the key on, and off once the car starts? Presumably this is the 4 speed auto tranny - so is OD light on?
Do you describe this as surge or tranny hesitation?? (as in transmission slipping at this speed, or engine idle hunting up an down??)
When idling in park or gear, is the idle constant? If you are in park and have same pressure on gas pedal as when the 'surge' occurs, is engine idle constant or surging??
Trying to figure if this is tranny hesitation problem, or idle flat spot....????

Assuming that this is idle flat spot, this can happen on 16v engines with vacuum/hose leaks. So you may want to check them to make sure (or check EGR to make sure diaphragm slides easily on its spindle)
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Old 05-25-2011, 09:57 AM   #5 (permalink)
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The check engine comes on with key and off after start. 3 speed auto.
This is a surge.
Engine does not surge at idel with car in park.
Will check Egr and vacuum leaks. I read the car for codes it does not have any present or stored. I can do a scan of freeze frame shots and post if you think will help.
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Old 05-25-2011, 10:07 AM   #6 (permalink)
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define a surge? (look at TACHO)
you saying if you drive 5mph
the ecu increases and decreases RPM of the engine, with right foot forzen
(the classic 2010 toyota syndrome?)
joking, is floor mat not hitting throttle pedal? LOL


the TPS must NEVER be closed , at 5mph
if it is you set it wrong, it takes careful calibration to do that.

surging can be lots of things

too rich
too lean
idle controls active , ILLEGALLY off idle.

this can be discovered easy.
1: calibrate the TPS per the TPS cal page.
2: force motor lean see results
3: force motor ritcher see results

and working on a 98 with no scan tool makes all this 10 times harder.

case in point:
i connect the scan tool
i look to see if Closed LOOP happens in about 10sec from start, and for sure in 30sec.
if not the EFI is bad,or 02 is bad or exh. leaks near it. or high fuel pressure. or too low.
lots of things can cause CL to fail

then drive 5mph
does the EFI system and scan tool show that CL is STILL happening.?
and look at LTFT at idle (after 02 i working)
and at 5mph.

LTFT must be near center 0. not 15%

LTFTs is long term fuel trim, if the O2 front is new, this LTFT is accurate.
if not, its not.

ask questions.

Surge can be called hunting. or unstable idle. and when moving , it is BAD, bad to the bone.

does it do it in reverse (be careful)? if yes , its probably the engine surging and not tranny slip. (low fluid ?)

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Old 05-25-2011, 03:32 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I probably would not even notice the surging on mine if it were not for the auto transmission whine. It rises and lowers as the thing surges along, of course I am still battling the ERG problem which might be related and the 740 code which I refuse to tackle until I fix the EGR. BTW is the very light whine normal for the auto trans? Also how can I tell if I have the 3 or 4 speed auto?
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Old 05-25-2011, 03:53 PM   #8 (permalink)
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whines are never normal.

the egr, only needs to close.
then remove hose to it (main) and plug it so it dont leak on hose side
once closed, and it cant leak, (cleaned and SPRING CLOSED leak free) then it cant leak at 5mph
if surge stops, then.....

egr is the top service point on a car.

3sp dont have an OD button, 3sp dont have power normal button nor the extra gears
on selector.
P R N D 2 L <<< unique to 4sp.

4speed dont have vacuum line to tranny modulator
4speed says on left side.03-72LE
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Old 05-25-2011, 04:16 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I have a scan tool. When I read the freeze data what am I looking for that tells me when I am in open loop or close loop?
I can post the data if that will help.
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Old 05-25-2011, 04:28 PM   #10 (permalink)
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All scanners are different, but the live data feed from my last Matco scanner simply had "ECU Run Status:" with either closed or open after it...
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