1.8 not staying warm

[jtgh]

thats the way to GO.

not every thing needs to be thrown away.

the carbon dust is great data, thanks !

[Jssuper]

I needed to join the forum mostly for this exact thread, well that is the original topic. This is going to be long, but worth it

'96 I have the exact same issue with the exact same rig.

Mine is a '98 Sport 1.8 4x4 5-spd and have had the same running cold problem. I live in Utah and we can get some brisk days, but I noticed the issue the early part of Sept when we had a cold spell that hit. Temps were in the high 50's - Low 60's for a couple days and thats when I noticed my temp gage on 'C' running down the freeway.... or any time my RPM's would go past 2600 (frequently in a Suzuki). I would get a little heat at a stop light, but when I accellerate away the temps would dump. Even when the weather was in the 70's I had the problem.

Now that we are in the 40's it just stays at 'C' without cardboard. When it was on C. The Temps:
Upper tank 114°,
the back of the coolant pipe by the ECT: 124°
therm housing: 95°

Items replaced:
4 thermostats: 2 - 180° and 2 - 195°, all different brands from, Checker, Autozone, CarQuest, and Parts for Imports.

All exhibited the exact same issue. Even the 195° stats made no difference. I boil tested 1 of the 180's and 1 195° and they worked perfectly.

I began to suspect the fan was moving to much air since I had replaced my fan Clutch only 2 days prior to the first noticeable problems. This led me to think it was the fan.

The fan clutch was a Hayden STD duty model from Checker. I purchased an OE fan and clutch from a junk yard and installed it. Only a slight improvement was noted. At the same time I replaced my radiator cap, for good measure.

Next I figured I must still be moving more air than needed and its air cooling the engine for some odd reason. I cut every other blade off of the "junked" fan. It did nothing but by this time the ambient temp outside is 48°.

I re-installed a 180° with a fresh rubber gasket from Parts for Imports and RTV'd the gasket to the therm and then RTV'd it in place in the engine to provide a good seal as an effort to ensure I wasn't getting coolant around the gasket or therm etc. Nothing.

Noticed the waterpump has been seeping a little from the weep hole.. Replaced it with a new unit. I think the issue got worse and it really should have... so that was good, but bad at the same time.

I even replaced the main temp sensor as at this point I'm grasping at straws, I thought maybe there is some computer controlled baffle that isn't working right cuz the sensor is faulty. Yah did nothing.... At this point, having been a veteran of about 8 Jeeps, I was going to dump my kick and go back to them as that would resolve the problem. Ehh no, I just couldn't turn tail like that... but the issue was really beginning to get to me. Everyone is stumped on this one.

[Jssuper]

I've finally fixed the problem, but I have a question... When did you replace your thermostat the first time? My thoughts would be when you replaced your radiator right? Me, it was in July during 100°+ weather and I did a coolant/radiator flush-fill, hoses and thermostat, service as the coolant was a bit old. My fan clutch also seemed a little soft so I ordered the new one, but didn't end up getting to it until Sept. Then when the cooler weather hit like a day later my rig ran cold....

I got to thinking back to July though and how suprised I was that the thermostat was so "different" to what the parts stores sell and what I have always used in everthing from Jeepsters, Mustangs, Silverado's and Trans-Ams. Everything had the therm at the top/front of the intake manifold right at the upper hose.

I vaguely remembver the OE therm being different, like it had two springs or something... Made a "cold" trip to the Suzuki Dealer and grabbed an OE Therm. Immediately I could see this was the remedy and now I can see the root cause of the problem. The thermostat is being forced open and unable to close/regulate properly due to its location.

The thermostat is the problem. None of the other cars I have ever owned/Own now have the therm at the bottom hose right at the pump and its obvious to me that the a-typical therm will not work in this situation as the pressures are obviously higher at the pump than at the top hose.

I'll show you what I'm getting at:



In this picture the OE therm is on the right and the 180° aftermarket is on the left (less the gasket obviously). The noticeable size difference, but more importantly is the size of the spring in the OE unit, like double the Ø. That will have a lot more force to regulate against the higher pressures of the pump. Also notice the rubber seal at the top of the "slide" or "piston" whatever you want to call it, that will seal off when closed much better than the aftermarket unit. I guess its really the "just cuz it fits, don't make it right" addage.



Top view, again the rubber seal there. Needless to say the $28 unit from the dealer was the cure to the ill. I installed it tonight and re-installed my 8 blade OE fan (with Hayden clutch) and took it for a ride. Outside temps were 42° and it was raining. Temp guage was rock solid center without cardboard and the heater was nice and toasty..

My cardboard pieces are in the brown file now... Hope it helps and goodluck to you!

[jtgh]

wrong stat

see rubber, it seals it up. ( no seal water walks around it)

some one sold you a 1.6L stat and you put in in a 1.8L

that wont work. as you see.

I think we have 100s of posting of people buying parts for 1.8L and getting the wrong parts.

Just tell them to show you the same part in esteem.

[jtgh]

napa has it
NAPAONLINE®

can even see both rubber pieces and the backwards sensor !!! see it. NAPA , give them business !

STANT co. makes no stat for 1.8L

mr.gasket sells 4363 at csk.com partsamerica is wrong part. and wrong temp too, 160f

and oem MG shows this stat for a chevy 350 and is 160deg
cskcom Checker+Shucks+Kragen+ORielly +partsamerica.com et al', is DOA on 1.8L !,has serious problems.

i see a trend that is sickening, if they don't have the part, they throw up anything, Chevy350 in the case of csk.com

Beck/arnley online data base has issues.


i examined the esteem listing for 1999 (first year 1.8L)
i found that csk.com has a thermostat seal
stant pn 25272 !!! bingo

i further checked out the suz pl. 99 esteem versas 96 1.8L sport.
same pump, same pump stat housing , same thermostat 82C

so that can help , ask for 99 Esteem stat.
i examined Stants online cat. is has nothing for Sport
but has below for 99 Esteem. (oops)


with below , we have a non oem part that works. get the gasket too.

[jtgh]

get the 45849 and 25272 195F
and mpg will rise nicely.
try it.

[jtgh]

source 2 , for sport 1.8L

Beck/arnley;
this co. has the same error, just a mirror opposite of stant !
no Esteem listed
an full support for 96-98 Sidekick sport.

see attach.

and the gasket too ! (not oem don't sell gasket separate so don't loose it)

039-0010 = gasket for stat
143-0688 = hot stat 192f


Beck or Stant are the 2 best non oem choices. the others are weak.


a triple hijack that ends well.

maybe.. .... LOL


i emailed both stant and beck about this.

same such a common service item needs to be so hard.

cheers to all.

[jtgh]

Stant corp, (response)
just emailed me and side the added the correct PN to sidekick 1.8L
and that they were looking and found simular errors in the GrandVitara.
next to contact , csk.com (5 fixs for 1 email. i hope)

[-Lawless]

Originally Posted by jtgh

Stant corp, (response)
just emailed me and side the added the correct PN to sidekick 1.8L
and that they were looking and found simular errors in the GrandVitara.
next to contact , csk.com (5 fixs for 1 email. i hope)

Good for you.
Most would just let the mistake go but you are truly one who cares.
Thank again JTGH

[jtgh]

your welcome and im going to contact the big beast on my next break.

csk.com (5 stores one online page)
show them the errors for Esteem , Grand vitara and the Sidekick sport.

nothing new, they even cross up other parts between sport and non sport on suzuki's.
many complaints for poor sport owners.

cheers.