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Old 02-07-2008, 03:41 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Desperate

Hi everyone. I am in desperate need of a wing diagram for a 97 vitara's distributor.
The vitara is an 07/07 model and has what seems to be a very rare distributor that has the coil inside the cap.
The only numbers I have found on it are ; 33100- 70E0 and T2T59071.
The info i'm after is how many wires go to the hall effect sensor and which wires they are, i've tried pulling it apart to check but I can't quite get to where the wires are to see them.
If anyone has any info about these dizzies, could you let me know as this tiny problem is giving me big headaches!
Thanks heaps.
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Old 02-12-2008, 09:48 PM   #2 (permalink)
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what size engine. many sold world wide?
1.6.
2.0
or v6?

see next post .,for my best shot.
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Old 02-12-2008, 09:54 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default hello desperado

Here is one kind of dizzy,

does look strange. coil, ignitor, cas , all in one.

triple trouble.

cheers

I pm'd U the full drawing set.

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Old 02-13-2008, 07:16 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Thanks heaps for your reply, sorry about the lack of engine capacity! The schematic you gave me is the right one so again I can't thank you enough for the info.
Have to get computer remapped regardless, but i'm sure that the diagram you gave me will come in handy soon. Thanks again.
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Old 02-13-2008, 01:48 PM   #5 (permalink)
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rempapping a kick ecu is problematic, how would you do that?
new VE maps, new Spark maps or new A/F maps?

see that Dizzy there bottom left.

there are 3 parts, each is testable on the car or on a bench.
if you need to know how , I can show you.

do you need help with no spark?
regards.

PS: (to all posters)
sorry I was not clear, I was asking what engine type, was in your car. it varies widly, by country.
many people forget to say what they are in fact driving, when they post.
eg: my suzuki wont start. is classic

these posting come in from all over the world and the cars vary widely in design , depending on country of origion.

when you post tell us what the man at the parts counter would ask.
year, displacment, valve count, Injectiontype, tranny,doors, 4wd or 2wd. ( on this forum please at least tell us what continent you live on, but the country would GREATLY help ,like this poster did)

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Old 02-14-2008, 02:42 AM   #6 (permalink)
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No, sorry again! I'm currently undertaking a turbo conversion on the zook, a mate of mine ordered me an aftermarket computer , however they mapped it for the wrong dizzie. The supplied map was for a reluctor type. I was hoping that the hall effect sensor only required two wires to operate so that we could still use the supplied map. But I have since learned that hall effect sensors use 3 wires. The diagram you gave me will definately come in handy, though.
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Old 02-14-2008, 01:06 PM   #7 (permalink)
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the whole raw deal. non too trivial.
frankenzok, bells ringing.... (sorry , most post here, my car wont start....)
there are two dizzy CAS generators. in zuks , maybe 3 (yours).

A vast number of ignitions ,there are.... (soundling like Yoda more and more)hehehe
one (like) my 91 has a buffered hall sensor.
it produces, a perfect square wave, perfect for any computer, ecu,etc.

one wire (3 wires total) is ground, other is +12v , the other is SIGnal.
wire signal to TACHIN on New ECU. ( piece of cake setup)
then ECU drives coil.

but... in your case the Ignitor is married to the coil.
so you must drive the old ignitor, you will need a 160 ohm pull up on the coil line to
make your new ecu drive a stock ignitor and then invert the coil drive.
inversion is necessary because the ignitor is an inversion device. (2 inversions = none)
if not coil burns up. (or ignitor)


it is very tricky on every car, cuz, they are all completely different. many years, many oem's

now the next sensor:
it is a VR effect unbuffered:
this is the raw output that has a very horrible signal , the kind of signal all computers
hate. it looks like a very poor sawtooth.
the proper circuit for that is the zero crossing detector.
in many cases there are 2 pots, variable resistors that allow you to adjust gain and bias to get the output to switch under all condtions.
they suk really. but will work. sort of like tuning a Marconi Radio in 1920.


i am pretty sure you want Hall sensor buffered set up.
just a simple tachIN setup.

that pin 3 white wire is the Hall sensor out signal a perfect square wave.
that pin must be pulled up with a 1000 ohm (brown/black/red) resistor to 12v for it to swing.

in electronics this is called a open collector output.
it can drives logical zeros but not ones" , it must be pulled up.
this can be proven with a scope or with my LED test unit.
the other 2 wires are power and ground , this power , powers the buffering logic in the CAS.

there are no PNP setups for KICKs, one must reverse engineer each piece and then
set the ECU up to input and output from such devices.

the two show stoppers are, IGNITION and COIL and IAC.
the others are all a piece of cake.

your ECU supplier must have had a complex order spec.
on that would be Ignition nightmare, one would check buffer hall sensor.
then 100 others, Ford DIS , Chev, whatever, Chrysler, Nissan, toyotal,,,,
giant list ,

i skipped one, tiny detail
that pull up on the CAS should be connected to 5vdc.
this is best done inside the ECU or to Vref if you have access to that pin on the
new ECU. (it might not be safe to pull up to 12v , going in to some ECU's)
Ask your supplier the range of voltages that are legal for tachin pin.

that is it, for Ignition.

YOur oem ignitor ,
Mine has an internal resistor to ground on the gate pin (input)
the mandates a hard 160 ohm drive source resistance or the coil will NOT fire.
ECU-tech
you can measure your gate with any ohm meter. ( ground to gate)

simply said the Ignitor is a low impedance input device. ( prevents false triggering).


cheers

ps , the ignitor can be fired , with just a cheap 160 ohm resistor from 12v to gate, just touch it to the gate
and it will FIRE when released. just like points ignition,huh?
Ignitor device is just emulating the points. the resistor is the dizzy cam of old.

testing this theory is important.

( to get mine to work I first got the cas working perfect , could see clean RPM pulses in the ECU softare)
then I made the Ignitor work on the bench,then I put in the pulls ups on my ECu , then my ECU gave me FIRE , lightning !
big and Fat .

im still setting up all the spark advance maps now. tedious but necessary.
in your case the mapping will be all guess and try. (dyno man will be rich)

Last edited by jtgh : 02-14-2008 at 01:21 PM.
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Old 02-15-2008, 12:13 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Wow, done this before? Your information is very indepth and surprisingly for me, I understand what you mean, thankyou.

But, because it's an aftermarket ecu, I have sent the computer back to them today along with the dizzie so they can sort it out. Then they'll send it back ready to go!

Your help is much appreciated, even though I probably won't get to use most of it, but I guess you do learn something new everyday!
Thanks again, hope to talk again soon.
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Old 02-15-2008, 12:33 AM   #9 (permalink)
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no problem, my ecu is DYI, no punch list order pray , reorder.
to solve that dilemma, others , just put in all GM or Ford sensors.
and it works first time. all designed to work together, but costs more
and is not very reversable. (mine will be pnp when done, home grown) It is just a practice car to do something nicer on the next project.
a 200sx turbo.

have fun on your project , hope they give you some real spark !!!
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