Friggin Frustrated NO Start

[bigbadjx]

I swear things just keep going downhill with my Sidekick. Today I decided ok, I am going to pull the timing cover off to make sure that the sprockets are aligned (timing marks are correct and where they need to be TDC) well come to pull off the cover, and guess what, they aren't The bottom was TDC while the camshaft sprocket was ~90* to the left from TDC, couldn't believe my car was running ok that far off. Well I pull the timing belt off, and align the camshaft sprocket to TDC, put everything back together, and go to crank it over, and the SOB will not turn over now. WTF is up? I thought maybe I am too low on gas and it is not catching, walked to the gas station, got me a gallon and a half, come back, still nothing. Everything is hooked back up just as it was before I did everything. Now I am just livid that this car is giving me sooooo many problems all of a sudden. And to put icing on the cake, I recieved my new CAT a couple days ago, and well, the description says it works with my Kick, and the O2 is after the CAT while mine is on the headers.

Can anyone help me out as to why my car is not turning over now?

Thanks guys

/rant

[lord_galathon]

There's a thread about a similar timing issue,

http://www.suzuki-forums.com/suzuki-...ng-timing.html

try placing the timing the way it was when you found it and see if that fixes it. If it does take a look at the thread above.

Also for your CAT, on 89~94s it's on the manifold and on 95~98s you have one on the manifold (only not smack in the center like the old er models, it's further back almost under the firewall) and one after the CAT. So the CAT you received would probably work.

Good luck.

[jtgh]

see next post for procedure.
this is an interference engine, please do not attempt to start it , OK?
get the procedure ( remember the disty rotates backwards from 8v and #1 on the disty cap is different location !)
see: see bottom of page for DIZZY graphic

dizzy

my point is that if you follow an 8v procedure you will mess up. (not your fault)
get the procedure
follow it. (when sure it right and before cranking!)
then rotate the crank by hand thru the whole cycle of the #1 cylinder looking at the cam.
TDC Intake Piston going down, then BDC
compression Piston going up back to TDC.
Fire Piston going down.Back to BDC.
BDC pistion going up , repeat.
I put a tye wrap "12 to 18 inches"long into spark #1 hole to watch pistion. ( or a compresson gage on #1)
watch timing marks, make sure all things above co-relate perfectly.
watch the cam lobs too and this will help greatly.

this validate step , makes darn sure you can crank engine and not smack the valves in to your pistons.

enjoy

[jtgh]

capturing your data now.
early data:
never rotate crank backwards ( CCW from front looking rear)
belt off:
NEVER move the CAM or the Crank more that 90deg
in any direction from perfect.
perfect is:
crank cog gear TDC mark and block mark aligned.
Cam Mark above E and top shroud plate V notch.

photos to follow.

[jtgh]

here is a 16v tbelt , replacement instructions
for 1994 exactly.

this should help you.

shows putting the E and mark at 12 oclock
and what NOT to do.

zip attach is 579k , inside is pdf
really just 10 jpg photos.

[bigbadjx]

jtgh, you are like the Sidekick god, there is no question you can not answer without DETAIL lolz. ok, well the instructions you gave me is the same instructions I used before even asking about this. Those are the same instructions I have through the military. Anywho, that is what I followed. What happens if you rotate the entire system CCW? Could that be causing my no start if I rotated it CCW?

[jtgh]

I get confused who has docs and who don't so I just pop em out. SOmeone will snatch em up.
Military, yes, now I remember you saying that.....

they had 3 rules. 2, i understand but
not turning backwards (while in normal mode)
I do not understand that.
My guess is that maybe the idler fails to keep out the slack backwards and puts the valves at risk. (smile)

I know other engines with variable valve timing hate this too. but that's not applicable here.

i think if you go slow its ok. (by hand gingerly)
after all rule 2 says CAM can go backwards 90 degress.
strange cus crank can be frozen at TDC in this rule.
check it carefully , then check spark.
prime it and it will start.

I understand your frustration !

break a leg

[bigbadjx]

well, come to take everything apart yet AGAIN, the timing marks were off, and causing the engine to not turn over. I was lucky that I did not screw up anything internally. I am guessing that I did not tension the timing belt properly when I had done it for the 2nd time, so this time I made sure EVERYTHING WAS PERFECT!!! I even turned the engine over by hand a few times to make sure everything was ok, and compressing, and the timing marks stayed aligned and BLAMO, I got it. Put everything back together, refilled the radiator, went to start her, and on the first try it turned right over! Boy does it make me feel MUCH better.

I took her out to warm her up so that I could set the timing, and WOW I did not realize this car was so touchy and has as much torque as it does lol. I guess there were some major issues that I was driving with when I was off with the marks prior to my no start situation.

I came back to set the timing, and grounded the #4 pin to the #5 pin, and I could not get the timing back to where it recommends between 4* & 6*, closest I could get it was ~9-10* without it either going way up past 20* or way below 0*, so I am guessing there might be something wrong with the idle or something else.

Now I am hoping that this is going to better my MPG, since before the engine was not be as efficient as it should have been. We will just have to wait and see about that though.

Thanks again to everyone for helping me out!

[jtgh]

first set idle , engine off.
place the jumper.start engine
I am so glad you didnt hurt a valve !!!
16v needs careful attention.
I think your are too advanced ? far from zero.


You need to move the DIZZY gear 1 tooth CCW.

Pull dizzy (just enough to clear gear mesh)
turn rotor 1 gear tooth CCW. re- Insert.

dizzy

then check it again, if works , go the other way 1 tooth.
takes a deft touch.

hope that makes sense.
regards,

[bigbadjx]

ok you got me confused, first set idle, engine off? How would I set the idle? Never messed with that before, EVER, never had to lol. My car as it stands at 10* is idling way too high at 1500+ RPMs.