97 esteem, no-start, sometimes

steemer · 10-31-2009, 06:10 PM

I just got a 97 Esteem with the 1.8l and I'm a noob to these cars. I got the car from my father-in-law. It has had no start problems for the past year. They have changed fuel pumps, sensors and just about anything else they can think of. I'm an electrician by trade so I troubleshoot, i'm not a parts-changer. Today the car didnt start and I began by jumping the fuel pump relay and got fuel pressure, Check! So it appears the computer is not telling the pump to come on, or the relay-on circuit is bad. Not seeing any pulses to the injectors during cranking. No spark while cranking either. I know that in alot of cars these days, the computer will not "tell" the fuel pump to come on, injectors to fire, or ignition to fire unless it receives the inputs it wants from certain sensors. so you have people throwing parts at them till they get lucky. The car has two coils, so if one went bad I think I would at least get some sputter from the other cylinders. I'm leaning towards the computer now, but I must make sure everything else is right. Humidity seems to also play a role in wether the car starts that day or not. What I could really use is a wiring diagram for the fuel, ignition, engine management, and computer systems. Any help or advice is wecome, Thank you!

Isuzuzuki man · 11-01-2009, 09:57 AM

The computer will tell the FP relay to come on for about 5 secs then go off until the engine starts. Sounds like the crankshaft position sensor is not giving a pulse, that pulse gives information for both spark and injectors I believe. I would get the codes pull too if you can.

jim_naisium · 11-01-2009, 06:00 PM

I agree, scan it for codes (even if the Check Engine light is not on), if there are any it should tell you what is wrong.

steemer · 11-05-2009, 08:35 PM

Can you tell me the hot, ground and signal wire colors for the cam and crank position sensors? I live in the stix and the AZone obd tester told me nothing. The nearest dealer is 50 miles away, and probably not too cheap either. I do have the tools and ability to test them if I knew. Btw found the cam sensor, where is the crank sensor located on these. I try not to ask stupid questions or waste peoples time for stuff that I can find on my own, and I usually buy a chiltons first thing with a new car but they and Haynes dont make one for it. any suggestions? Thanx for your help so far guys, Scotty.

steemer · 11-08-2009, 02:33 PM

Bump. I'm still trying to find where the crank position sensor is located on my 1.8 with an auto trans. any help please?

WastedP · 11-09-2009, 12:11 AM

I've never touched the 1.8 so I can't offer you anything from experience. Just this manual pic, not the most helpful.

steemer · 11-09-2009, 06:41 PM

Thank you much! Well, after scratchin my head for a while I realised the image shows the BOTTOM of the engine! Checked the ckps and found it to be good. Kinda got thrown onto another track now. found out that the fuel pump is supposed to come on for 3-5 seconds when you try to start. When the cpu receives a signal from the crank sensor, it will leave the pump on. If it doesnt see it, then the pump turns off. right now the fuel pump isnt coming on at all. Tested and jumpered the relay and the pump comes on and I get pressure. Now we are onto the wiring that activates the fuel pump relay. With the key in the "run" position the 12v power wire to the relay coil [white with blue stripe wire] is hot, so I think "hey, must be a bad ground!". I then ground the - side of the relay coil and I blow the IG fuse under the dash!? I cant waste anymore time tracing wires, need a schematic for the 1.8 engine systems badly. The IG seems to control the cpu, injectors, coils/ign, and fuel systems. Help.

Isuzuzuki man · 11-09-2009, 10:12 PM

So if you leave the relay jumped, pump running, does it start? If it has a tach does the tach jump when you crank it?

steemer · 11-09-2009, 10:14 PM

No it does not, the coils and injectors are still not firing.

jim_naisium · 11-10-2009, 01:03 AM

Steemer, go here and download the first 12 manuals: Suzuki engine manual for sy413, sy416, sy418

Create a main folder and inside that folder create 12 more folders called INDEX01, INDEX02, etc., then unpack all 12 files into their own folders, after that go into the Index01 folder and click on the TOP pdf file to open the manual.

After it opens click anywhere on the first page, on the next page you should see a big NEXT in the upper right corner, click it until you are on the 3rd page.

Once you are on page 3/3 look for Manual Group 13, go over to the right and click on the E (for English), then go over and click on "System Circuit Diagram" at this point the manual is multi-lingual due to the fact that electronic symbols are more or less universal, so don't be surprised if while scrolling down you are seeing foreign languages, sometimes they make better descriptions than the English descriptions are.

I have had mixed results getting this to open correctly on Ubuntu Linux systems but it opens fine on Windows systems with the Adobe Reader.

Hope this helps you.