I couldnt keep it going long, and it was more of a burn out on dry pavement, however, with more HP, I'm sure you could drift with a FWD.. but rear wheel is alot easier..
How would more hp help? I dont know crap about drifting...never looked into it or read it but there is drift sessions all the time between my track sessions and I've talked to many of them just about there car setup. The best two guys I see out there on a regular bassis have less hp than my forenza currently has.
I know if I learned how to setup a FWD drift car I could probably get the forenza to do it okay...nothing like RWD but still. I dunno the exact definition of drifting either but I know I've had the rear out and kept it out at 50-60mph for 100 yards or more a few times but stopped doing that once when I smacked a curb real hard. Just e-brake and let the rear brake loose be keep the throttle just enough to leave it out a little bit but not pull it back in too hard.
Whenever the tires need replaced on my Moms car she lets me drift it (not near any curbs though)...its a/t with tiptronic thingy. BMW 330ci...has less guts below 50mph than my car does but still gets the end out pretty damn well once you learn how to do it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loganator
I wouldnt recommend serious drifting on stock equipment... the suspension, and wheels cannot handle it.
I dont see why it can't handle it...I might the stock car is balanced...if you upgrade something here and there extreamly well then that makes everything else much weaker. The reason I say it can handle it is I've beat up on my car more than anyone here and have driven it to 75k miles with only one small random defect.
Okay, all mighty automotive master.. first off, if you take the crappy stock forenza, and slide it around sideways... doing a real drift, your going to mess up the suspension... thats why you get more sturdy parts if your going to really do it.. and to answer why more HP helps.. well in reality your want more torque, this will alow you to more easily burn your tires..the warmer your tires get, the less grip they get, thus reducing traction which is needed for drifting.. absolutly you can do it in a car with less power.. I know because I just went out tonight and did it in my forenza.. in a wide open parking lot, as to avoid curbs, dee dee dee.. you can do everything with a FWD as a RWD, just in a different way.. dont believe me? come up here and Ill show ya.
Wow, testy. I have seen some strange stuff done on stock parts though. I've seen FWD drifting on stock. They just inproved the handbrake cable. Not enough room to do it properly, sence it was a demo on a short track, hence the handbrake
Why do people call it an emergency brake anyways? Its not very effective as an emergency braking system. More like a parking brake
Why do people call it an emergency brake anyways? Its not very effective as an emergency braking system. More like a parking brake
My guess it has to do with car history, as it may have been at one point called and used as an emergency brake. But I do know the emergency parking brake is usefull when your car's water pump goes and you lose all power stuff (ie steering, brakes, etc), and the only way to stop is using the parking brake.
Loganator, where in Mi do you reside, Im a Mi native as well, born in Redford off 8mile and lived up around TC and Charleviox for nearly 18 years. I love Icy parking lots. When we would get the first snow my freinds and I would wait all day like kids waiting to open presents, except our present was when the grocery store closed and all the slush would start to freeze.
A freind from back home and I were talking about this a couple of weeks ago. His son just turned 16 and this is his first winter behind the wheel. He took him up to the store parking lot and was showing him how to do some "manuvers". Well his wife flipped on him and his defense made a lot of sense. If you learn to control a car that you sent out of control on purpose then you won't panic when it goes out of control on its own. My self I learned how to drive in a VW sandrail and every since then have thought swinging the ass end out sideways is about the most fun you can have in a car. Wether you call it drifting or not its fun.
Kinky, my understanding of the technical definition of drifting exludes front wheel drive, my understanding of it is controlling a slide in a RWD by using the throttle to control the amount of spin to the rear wheels. Or pedal steer as Porsche owners would call it. If you have the Dukes of Hazard DVD check the special features and there is a great clip of the stunt driver drifting the General Lee around a circular drive and an explanation of what he is doing. I think the best you can do in a FWD is a balanced slide not true drifting.
I have seen people drift with front wheel drive. It is nearly impossible to do on a flat road course however. Downhill racing is a whole other ball game, when you are coming downhill with a decent amount of speed it is possible to break traction and use the power of the vehicle to keep you drifting through several curves if they are close enough together. It takes a damn good driver to do it however.
Dog, I fully agree with your friends philosophy. Several times I have had my car loose traction and due to being used to the car sliding I was able to keep my cool and bring the car back under control easily. Back when I was first learning to drive, I know I would have went straight for the brake as hard as I could.
Drifting to me is more of an art form than a motorsport. I am not trying to take away from the skill it takes, because it takes years of practice to learn to use the car as an extension of yourself. In my own mind you have to learn to feel what the car is doing, not think of technique. For instance, I should not be coming up to the corner thinking to myself: Okay I need to apply the brakes a bit to shift the weight to the front of the vehicle to unload the rear, then transfer weight to the outside in order to induce oversteer, then balance the slide....blah blah blah. It has to come second nature in order to be able to drive in a relaxed manner in order to keep your cool. The car needs to be an extension of you, almost as if you know what the vehicle is thinking. Feel what the tires are doing through the steering wheel, feel g forces and know what they are causing, know when you are at the jagged edge of control and how much more you can force out of the tires, and be okay with it. Controlled khaos, that is the best definition I can come up with. Its like driving at about 125% of your vehicles potential with bursts to 150%.
Sorry for the rant, and I hope it makes some form of sense to someone. I am very passionate about driving. Nothing in life is better. Vehicular art, yeah thats a nice concept.
__________________
"Oversteer is when the passenger is scared; understeer is when the driver is scared!!"
"Thats why you can't hit 120. Get a set of better tires with a high enough speed rating and you should hit it." -Jurupa
Okay, all mighty automotive master.. first off, if you take the crappy stock forenza, and slide it around sideways... doing a real drift, your going to mess up the suspension... thats why you get more sturdy parts if your going to really do it.. and to answer why more HP helps.. well in reality your want more torque, this will alow you to more easily burn your tires..the warmer your tires get, the less grip they get, thus reducing traction which is needed for drifting.
Truth be told, it is not neccesarrily that you will mess up your suspension, it is that a quality aftermarket suspension has the ability to keep you from killing yourself as easily. And what you said about torque and being able to burn your tires....less grip....Think about it for a second. Front wheel drive......why would you want to lose grip with your front wheels? You absolutely want the most traction possible on the front wheels!!! Hence spending so much time getting the proper caster and camber setup in order to continue traveling in the direction intended!!! You do not want to reduce traction, as a matter of fact you need the best tires possible in order to keep traction while drifting if that makes sense. Those tires you see people burning off during contests are NOT cheap throwaways with no tread on them. They are top notch tires. You are breaking traction by spinning the tires, however they are still providing grip while you are sliding.
__________________
"Oversteer is when the passenger is scared; understeer is when the driver is scared!!"
"Thats why you can't hit 120. Get a set of better tires with a high enough speed rating and you should hit it." -Jurupa
Okay, all mighty automotive master.. first off, if you take the crappy stock forenza, and slide it around sideways... doing a real drift, your going to mess up the suspension... thats why you get more sturdy parts if your going to really do it.. and to answer why more HP helps.. well in reality your want more torque, this will alow you to more easily burn your tires..the warmer your tires get, the less grip they get, thus reducing traction which is needed for drifting.. absolutly you can do it in a car with less power.. I know because I just went out tonight and did it in my forenza.. in a wide open parking lot, as to avoid curbs, dee dee dee.. you can do everything with a FWD as a RWD, just in a different way.. dont believe me? come up here and Ill show ya.
Nah, you want mess up the suspension. It'll just be sloppy out there when you push it.
Wait what? first off if you have really good tires burning them out will only make them grippyier...to a point they will start to get greasy but its still probably better than dead cold. 2ndly you dont want your front tires to be slippery when your drifting, actually you dont want any of your tires slippery ever. Also if you in a drift contest or something other than just screwing around they want as much drift as possible. The faster, more angled, and longer the drift the more points they get.
I know when I drift the BMW when the rear tires start to get greasy its not as easy to control... since its such an expensive car that I cannot afford I always let the tires cool down so I have as much control as possible
you all make good points, and I was thinking with RWD, you'd wanna roast your tires.. my bad.. so basically, sliding on Ice = super fun.. and educational... I have never been in a weather related accident, mostly attributed to my ability to handle my car when I loose control.. *knocks on wood* I dont live far from there to answer your question, I'm about 20 miles north of Ann Arbor.
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