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Old 12-31-2012, 07:01 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default 2001 1.6L, Escudo not starting

I have a escudo 2001 with the GA 16 engine,the vehicle was driving ok no problems and just start to loose power and stalled.I check for fuel and find pump and relay is ok.I check for spark and that is ok.If i spray carb clean in the manifold the vehicle will run until the cleaner burns off.I check the injector harness with noid lights and the harness is ok.What would stop the injectors from fueling if there are gettinh voltage to them.
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Old 12-31-2012, 08:11 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Though you clicked on the right name on the side bar it led you to the 1989-1998 Escudo/sidekick/vitara/tracker part of the site.

Your Escudo would land in this part of the site:

1G (1999-2005) Vitara & Grand Vitara - Suzuki Forums: Suzuki Forum Site

It is also a good idea to put your location on your profile as vehicles vary with different markets. Put your vehicle specs in your signature as well and it will aid in getting help as the difference between engines, transmissions and length mean that there are different parts specs and procedures.

If everything checks out and you simply aren't getting fuel ok you can have dead fuel pump, clogged fuel filter or clogged lines.

Are the plugs wet when you swing it for a while? If yes then you can have bad fuel.
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Old 12-31-2012, 08:17 AM   #3 (permalink)
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wrong forum but EFI MPI is well EFI MPI
so can answer

the ECU fires, the injectors.
if all 4 are dead..(you said the NOID flashes 4 times, right? so)
no fuel pressure


i bet you think 1psi fuel flow is good, right?
no
only 30 psi works, and that cant be tested with out. a real gauge.
i have a friend that uses a calibrated thumb at 30psi but he's dead
his sidekick (a fello worker) smoked, and caught fire.


the injector are all clogged, 4 dry spark tips'
or the pressure is not at 30
i bet you did not clog all 4. i bet.
you so good at testing,this is easy, 10 points ! great post.!!!


if im wrong and you did not check all 4 sparks for flooding.
say flooding. and we can work that on any EFI.
they should have an EFI forum, huh?
and folks with tools.

FYI. starting fluid can start a motor then it refloods
it's that hOT. always read spark tips, its the litmus test. of engine.s

Last edited by xxx; 12-31-2012 at 08:20 AM.
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Old 12-31-2012, 11:06 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scudo View Post
Though you clicked on the right name on the side bar it led you to the 1989-1998 Escudo/sidekick/vitara/tracker part of the site.

Your Escudo would land in this part of the site:

1G (1999-2005) Vitara & Grand Vitara - Suzuki Forums: Suzuki Forum Site

It is also a good idea to put your location on your profile as vehicles vary with different markets. Put your vehicle specs in your signature as well and it will aid in getting help as the difference between engines, transmissions and length mean that there are different parts specs and procedures.

If everything checks out and you simply aren't getting fuel ok you can have dead fuel pump, clogged fuel filter or clogged lines.

Are the plugs wet when you swing it for a while? If yes then you can have bad fuel.
Thank you for your reply.The fuel pressure is good and a new fuel filter was fitted.The spark plugs are not wet at all.This is a very strange problem because the injector harness flashes the noid lights whe ther hooked up to the connectors.
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Old 12-31-2012, 12:32 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
wrong forum but EFI MPI is well EFI MPI
Yeah, it's one of those odd ball Zukes that normally get entertained (the 1.6's) in the Track / Kick section, but he's in a newer platform.
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Old 12-31-2012, 01:28 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alanwood View Post
Thank you for your reply.The fuel pressure is good and a new fuel filter was fitted.The spark plugs are not wet at all.This is a very strange problem because the injector harness flashes the noid lights whe ther hooked up to the connectors.
What pressures are you getting from the fuel rail?

As you mention. Dry sparks = no fuel

So the injectors for sure are firing then you are looking along the lines to see which component has failed. Let us know the pressure figures and if they are adequate then you know it is injectors, if no then you have to look further upstream.

Why was the new filter fitted? In response to the problem or prior to the problem?

Another importance of where you are located is, if for instance, that if you are located near me it is likely that you are seeing terribly dirty fuel from time to time.
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Old 12-31-2012, 05:11 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I am getting 32psi of fuel pressure,i change fuel filter 2 weeks ago when i was tune the vehicle.
I am in Barbados West Indies
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Old 12-31-2012, 05:14 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I am starting to feel that my Ecu is the problem,even though i am getting current to the noid lights from injector harness.I don't thimk the injectors is the problem,this problem just started suddenly with no warning signs at all and no fault codes.
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Old 01-01-2013, 09:02 AM   #9 (permalink)
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DO you have an OBD scan tool for this car?or working blind?
keep an open mind, do not assume anything but diagnostic logic.
and win, i can tell this posted questions is for you Assuming.
please stop FEELING and start testing,use facts not feelings or assumptions.
(my instructors yelled this to me 100 of times, and then learned it the hard wAY)

do the the tests. the right way.
1.6L MPI ,
do all 4 injectors fire with the NOID? with equal brightness?
if all 4 fire and all 4 are dry (look at spark tips or do the injector balance test)
do you know how to do that test?
its not hard. YOU HAVE tHE TOOL. Use the tools right.
Duane's world
see first 6, (injectors)
seen here in video and is covered in my injector test page,
works on any MPI.

what he does is crank the motor with 1 injector connected. and the pressure gage.
he then sees the pressure drop (yup, injector squirted)
then repeats each time on injector connected at a time.
and takes careful note. did all 4 drop at the same rate or fail to drop at all>????
see the master do his craft.

the injector is hidden, but there are 2 ways to see what it does.
spark test.
the balance test.
not to mention noid results and better a scope.
you do know that noid cant find weak drivers in ECU.
The NOID is toy level device. only a scope is top dog.
the scope can see injectors hanging up an other anomalies.

i dont expect you to have a scope only want you to know why real shops
find problems 10x faster. better tools.
a $100 tool to boot. (i like HQ used scopes)


PS
when you say
Quote:
checked
that means ZERO
there are many tools and ways and methods, to do checks.
tell tool. or way,

EG:
the tachometer goes to 300 RPM cranking,if not ECU cuts injection.
Is the TPS sensor TP pin, (i think this year is a 3 pin TPS) and must be
at about 0.5volt, with cold start valve retracted. if at 4v the ecu will CUT ALL FUEL.
I do not have full spec on this car, but the throttle must not show over 75%
a scan toll excels at finding this silly fault.

I Look at spark tips,
i used the noid, with injector connected and disconnected
i measured ,each injector coil with ohmmeter (Resistance) they are all 10ohms
i then listened to them using test fuel. vermmommm
i hear the clicks, it is hard do with a crappy rubber hose, i have a real electronic
stethoscope ear, may DIY tests (hoses, ) you need to repeat it 5 times, to be sure.
you get what you pay for in tools...time or money.
i connected my sonic tool to each injector and all 4 are dead.

i'd the tachometer swinging up scale cranking.

i posted extra tests, because I feel you do yours wrong or skipped important checks.
wires can open at any time. and pumps go to zero
etc
do the tests while the failure is present.

it runs on test fuel, id still do a compression test.
just to check off , the first test . good motor.
i think spark is ok. it runs on test fuel
but look at timing, ?
if the cam belt or chain slipped it can slip 2 ways,
retarded, or advanced,
some times test fuel works with discover timing wrong
I FACT is connect my light at first look, just to see if while cranking
the strobe lands right , if not , im ON IT.

the spark timing will be way off, if any chain or belt slips.
its the best sign ever. and is what a 5 min job.. freeze jumper planted.

usually it retards, due to crank wanting to go faster than cam.

last idea
again.
ALL FOR NOID lamp checks, DEAD? you never said.
injectures fire and flow for 3 reasons
full 12v on once side, 5mS pulse to ground on the other
and 32psi on real
and injector not packed, closed, they do have 10micron screens, you know.

all 3 above pass. you did the test wrong.

use the balance test.
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Old 01-01-2013, 09:29 AM   #10 (permalink)
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i will repost based on , all tests were done wrong. (i failed you) no problem...
I will assume all 4 injectors flash with the same level brightness?
if not skip all the below.
why say an ecu is bad if it injects>????? and flashes NOID at each position?


and that test fuel passes (im sure it does,just being accurate here)

and that the 12vdc pins on all 4 injectors hold near, 12vdc KEYON (11v cranking)
1: The DASH Tachometer, swings to 300 RPM cranking. 1= 1000 so .3 = 300 RPM
2; the TPS TP pin is near 0v and not anywhere near 4v.
and open TPS ground causes, what.? all injection to end.!
3: the scan tool (shows no errors, or if OBD1 shows no codes stored, key on cranking
for 15-10seconds.(if obd2 , see RPM, and TPS angle =0 to 10%)
4: static timing is at spec. 5Deg.BTC or spec.
5; Do the injector balance test. it fails.... remove it put in a clean one and IT passes. it was in fact clogged, my be 3 more, huh?
6: bad fuel , tank with lots of water inside, do a fuel test , at the rail.
fill a tin can at the rail, with fuel, pour it in to a glass jar (2 man job,one at KEY)
let set a few hours, see floating water balls. in the jar, or more.>?

keep i mind injector can clog in 3 places inside the injector
wiki injectors?
at the screens (back flushing only works)
at the Pentil (ending clicks)
and at the nozzle.


so just because an injector clicks,dont mean its good. its just 1 test of many
only flow checks work,
ok bad gas can clog all 4, injectors, so dont ASSUME anything. do that tests

you are now running. im sure.


testing injection

i hope i saved you $400 for a new ECU. sure do.

there are other vary odd failures.
did you measure fuel pressure cranking? or just keyon.
did you do the keyon, key off fuel pressure drop test.?
oops.
see my my pump page ,this time do all the tests there.

Fuel-pump-testing

#6 and 8 you cant do..
all others are important
ive seen 2 failures.cause odd results. or..
eg, pinched fuel line, redistricting flow
so when injectors fire, pressure falls like rock
so do the test.
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